Calvin Kraft not a Mr. Bball finalist?

by **RedWings7** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 3:45 pm

How is this kid not a Mr. Bball finalist??? I saw him play this year twice and he had 38 and 35. Last year I saw him have 45 and 28. He averaged 24.7 pts and 8.6 rebs this year. He was on the All-Tourney team at a bunch of summer AAU tournaments this summer. I even heard from a Central Cass parent say that Gonzaga wanted him to walk on. I mean Voth and Tivis are solid picks, but I would definitely say Kraft is equal or better than them both. Voth gets everything off of his jumping, he's not that talented. Tivis gets a lot of his points at the line and shoots a lot... Kraft will definitely be a BMOC at Valley City State for the next 4 years. They've got a heck of a recruit on their hand.

by **B-ball1** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 3:49 pm

Are you serious Voth not talented are you kidding me. He is obviously a choice and Payton Tivis did not shoot alot if he was on just about any other team he would of been put up 30 every night

by **spartan1** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 3:57 pm

well first of all i dont know what ur talking about at all. have u even seen jaden voth play, that kid is amazing he shoots the ball good, dribbles good, and to top it of he can jump out of the building. i also have seen payton tivis play on numorus occasions and you cannot say that he shoots alot because he passed up alot of shots this season to get other players involved.(Pauley, Breen, Burke, Maher) And keep one thing in mind payton tivis had an excellent year while playing on a broken foot. I think the canidates were picked fairly.

by **rainmaker** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 4:57 pm

Tivis shoots a lot, and Voth isn't talented???!?! Please......First off, you must not have seen Tivis play, and I don't think a kid who isn't talented is going to be a Mr. Basketball nominee....You can agrue about a 5th nominee, but you don't have to cut down the players that WERE nominees.

by **B-ball1** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:37 pm

Exactly and it seams like your just kind of mad because he didnt make it. So you rip the other canidates thas just bad

by **bill** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:43 pm

Voth and Tivis are very talented. First of all, you havent seen either play this year. Voth is quicker than lightning, extremely athletic, and can dunk over anyone. Tivis is a smart player who doesnt shoot alot. How can you possibly say Tivis shoots more than someone like Craft? Craft shoots about 15 3-pointers every game. Tivis also shoots about 20% higher than Craft. And Voth is untalented? That is the most ridiculous statement i have ever heard. How can you call a 5'9" North Dakota kid who can elbow dunk untalented?

by **spartan1** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:43 pm

Ive heard that calvin kraft shoots to much. not payton tivis

by **timmyg** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:49 pm

i agree with bill. any kid who shoots as much as Kraft does is bound to have huge games once in awhile. personally, i think the kid is overrated. he is a good player, but doesn't seem to be much of team player. was i surprised he was left off the ballot? not really, i felt the nominees were well deserving, and like i said if you shoot more than all your teammates combined you're going to score! as far as the gonzaga thing, i kind of find that hard to believe simply because kraft doesn't have the size to play DI ball. He'd get pushed around like no other. Definitely a DAC player, but no higher in my opinion

by **B-ball1** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:52 pm

Yeah i agree Kraft is a good player but he is no Payton or Jaden and congrats to them for being nominated

by **ndfan** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:54 pm

It really didn't matter Mertens or Erdman were gonna win it, they just put a couple class B guys on their that had good years. Don't get me wrong Kraft, Voth, and Tvis are all excellent players and will do well wherever it is they go. But the bottom line is it didn't matter it was a class A guys to win.

by **RedWings7** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 5:57 pm

HEY, IN NOW WAY AM I RIPPING ON VOTH OR TIVIS, im just trying to say Kraft belongs in their league and shouldve been a finalist, just like voth and tivis

by **rainmaker** » Wed Mar 22, 2006 7:55 pm

It really didn't matter because a class A guy was going to win it anyway? Well, it's a wonder they even had a vote if it was already decided before hand....according to the paper Tivis received 3 first place votes, and Erdmann received 2 first place votes. I know that Erdmann was second in the voting, but boy, it seems as though it wasn't so cut and dry....Thank goodness they "just put a couple class b guys on there that had good years."

by **ndfan** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 3:06 am

[user=175]rainmaker[/user] wrote:

It really didn't matter because a class A guy was going to win it anyway?Ã‚Â Well, it's a wonder they even had a vote if it was already decided before hand....according to the paper Tivis received 3 first place votes, and Erdmann received 2 first place votes.Ã‚Â I know that ErdmannÃ‚Â was second in the voting, but boy, it seems as though it wasn't so cutÃ‚Â and dry....Thank goodness they "just put a couple class b guys on there that had good years."Ã‚Â Ã‚Â

I bet all those first place votes were from guys out west that have seen him play and never got a chance to see Mertens or Erdman play. Erdman I'm sure lost all his first place votes to Mertens because he got all seconds I'm sure from the people who voted Mertens which is why he came in second in the voting. JMHO

by **rainmaker** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 6:38 am

A kid from Bowman, and a kid from Fargo, who do you think had more media people watching them??

by **CLASSB2001** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:16 am

Mertens and Erdman were more talented, that's why they got the most votes. Watching on saturday night I was amazed how much bigger Erdmann and Mertens were standing next to tivus. They looked five years older.

Class B needs a "jaw dropping capture the imagination I just led my team to the state championship game in front of the whole state" type of player to have a chance to win a Mr.Basketball. Hunter Berg had that. Marty McDonald of Munich had that. Scott Guldseth had that. The buzz about Berg was hitting 54 points in a region semi-final game and his high school has 25 kids for an enrollment. The buzz about Marty was he lost to Watford on TV the year before, but now he's back for revenge the next year and how nobody ever hit a fair ball off of him in a high baseball game. The buzz about Guldseth was Lute Olson, Dale Brown and Clem Haskins were at all his home games recruiting him(which were probably just rumors).

Those players were legendary. Voth and tivis are popular Dickinson area players, but just not statewide known. For an example see: Rebecca Fieckert, Miss Basketball. Everyone says "Ooo, she's going to Kansas U., Rock shock jayhawk". Do you see my point.

by **ndproduct** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:55 am

I know that Kraft is a solid player, but if he doens't even win the district player of the year, I don't know if he deserves to be a Mr. Basketball finalist...

by **rainmaker** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 8:10 am

Exactly....If there were two kids (a Class B guy and a Class A guy) that were equally talented, and had the same stats, who do you think would be Mr. Basketball? It just kinda seems as though the Class A guy would, right? The Class B player has to be above and beyond any Class A player without question, in order to win. Just a thought.

by **BBall dominator** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:48 am

And its harder to put up those types of numbers in class a because in class b about 5-8 to games a year you play a team that isn't quite what we would call competitive in class a you get a game almost every night. Calvin Kraft is a good player but in class a he would not average 20+ pts. a game nor would more than 1/2 the players in class b.

by **rainmaker** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:59 am

SCC wrote:There's more media in the Class A towns than the Class B towns. It's that simple.

Thats exactly what I meant.

by **UNC1** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:26 pm

Payton Tivis could average 20 a game in class A

by **West Dakota** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 6:41 pm

I totally agree with bill on this one!

Just saw on the news tonight that three boys from region 7 made the first team on the all state team, not to shabby!

Jaden Voth, Payton Tivis and Jeff Smith

Landon Smith and Derick Pauley also made the team from this region.

Way to go boys!

by **ndfan** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 6:50 pm

anybody have a list of kids that made the class B all-state team?

by **West Dakota** » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:03 pm

Here you go, I believe this is correct. Nice group of players for sure!

1st team

Jaden Voth

Payton Tivis

Jeff Smith

Zach Larson

Luke Lorenz

2nd team

Landon Smith

Jarvis Bearstail

Tom Bachmeier

Derek Pauley

Ross Florhaug

Calvin Kraft

Taylor Man

Ethan Evenson

Tony Iron Heart

Derek Benter

Dustin Erbes

Lance Hollinger

Neil Packineau

by **bballer2** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 8:32 am

ok i played with all of these guys this summer voth, kraft, tivis and if you think kraft should have been a candidate before tivis and voth and are at the same league as these 2 you are totally wrong. Don't hate on these guys because these guys are great ball players. You say voth is not that tallented... wow he is 3 times as talented as kraft he is by far the best most athletic ball player i've ever played with and has much room for improvement. Tivis on the other hand is a guy that has a great work ethic and still has room to get better also. Very unselfish and humble and is a great ball player. Yes kraft can play ball and is a streaky shooter but dont hate on these other two guys because they can play ball and work very hard at it.

by **West Dakota** » Sun Mar 26, 2006 12:53 pm

bballer2

It's nice that you could chime in with your first hand experience with Jaden.

And Bill you hit the nail on the head with your comments as well!

I know I talk about him allot and folks think I'm bragging him up. But the truth is I would talk about anybody in the area and brag them up if they were as good or better. Being from Glen Ullin and playing on the #1 ranked teams of the 80s I've gotten to see allot of talented players. Non of them were as athletic as Jaden is thou.

"Voth gets everything off of his jumping, he's not that talented"

WHAT??????

Ask the boys from Dickinson Trinity who gave them the biggest fits these past couple years, I'd bet most of them would mention the 5' 10" kid from Glen Ullin.

Everyone talks about how he can jump and they think that's all there is to his game. But he is one of the finest ballhandlers I've seen in these parts as well, and before he got hurt in the Hazen game late in the season he could just about drive in elevate and score at will. And if you were open he'd get you the ball every time. "But I WILL miss watching a kid his size jump like he could, doubt I'll ever see it again in my lifetime here in ND." To watch his first dunk at that halliday tourney in Mandan when he was a 5' 8" sophmore is something I will never forget. Watching everyone grab their programs looking and asking themselves "how tall was that kid?"

I would venture to guess that he will get one of the best college offers of all the class A and B players this year. And if you read the class A board they talk about our B kids like they are a bunch of talentless midgets. But when I watched those state 3 on 3 tournys last summer I never did see a class A kid that could stop Jaden as he won yet again another state title.

It will be fun to watch the Lions all star game this year, does anyone know when they will be?

Calvin Kraft not a Mr. Bball finalist?

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