Why not the "Betty"?

[hoopsattm]

If there is anyone out there that can give me one solid reason why the Region 2 Boys' basketball tournament went from the Betty Englestad Arena back to Grafton, I, along with hundreds, if not thousands of others would like to hear it. I've heard some very poor reasons, but none that really make a lot of sense. There's the price at the door. $7 at the Betty, $5 elsewhere. Problem with that excuse is that the $7 at the Betty gets you into all four games on opening day. At other venues, you pay to watch the early games and pay another five spot to watch the late games. OK, over the course of three days, you may eventually pay more, but isn't sitting in that facility worth it? Concession prices too expensive? They're always more expensive at places like that. The people making this complaint the most are the people sitting in hospitality rooms eating for free anyhow. Travel time? Yes, Grafton is closer for teams from the northern end of the valley, but Grand Forks is closer for the teams on the south side. We used to drive to Mayville every other year, and if my ND geography is current, Mayville is about 40 miles south and west of Grand Forks. And, the last I looked, there are a few more places to eat, and a few more places to go, in Grand Forks than there are in towns like Grafton, Mayville, etc. There are some rumors flying around that a VIP or two, or three, pulled a few strings to get this done, but I don't want to break the rules of the website, so I'll keep those rumors out of this message. Cut the crap, guys. Let's do what's right. Get a great tournament like this one at a neutral site and at the best facility. The "Betty" is that place.

[region 2 opinion]

I couldn't agree more. The only other region in the state to play on a neutral site is in Dickinson and they have tried to get it moved to a neutral site but there is just not one available in that area. We have the finest site in N.D. available and willing to host. It would be just like playing in the State Tournament to some kids who don't often get to go to the regional. Going back to Grafton and possibly losing out in the first round won't be much of a memory for them. Playing in the "Betty" even just one game they will remember for the rest of their lives. After all, aren't we suposed to be doing things for the students?? The two ring leaders who went behind everyones back and got this moved to Grafton have special interests in having it in Grafton. One of them was a big pusher to have it in the "Betty" before he moved elsewhere. Interesting the change of heart there!! The other has an even bigger reason for it being in Grafton. There was no final coaches vote and it has nothing to do with economic development.

[COACHWEST]

Region 8 Girl's is facing a similar situation. Williston State College has "The Well" which is a "fan"tastic facility. They treat teams and fans very well. New Town has the Northern Lights Center. Great facility also--has some minor design flaws which do not serve basketball the best. The Region tournament has been moved to New Town. No disrespect to the people of New Town, but almost everyone from out of New Town that you talk to would like to see the tourney in Williston. The community is better prepared to handle the volume of people. The bigger issue is New Town will be playing on their home floor. Many people have argued this for years. In a tournament where one team advances, use a nuetral floor. For District tournaments, I will agree with SCC, use a Class B school if possible. It is a "locally" controlled tourney. Keep the money local and let the fans have the small school atmosphere. Four teams advance to the next level. For a Region Tourney, it is NDHSAA controlled. No local control, no local money. Only one team advances.

[ndlionsfan]

Very well said CoachWest....I agree. I believe all region tourneys should be played at nuetral sites. I also think that district tourneys should try to be played at a class B school and preferably not on a nuetral site. I'll use region 4 boys for an example. I don't like the fact that Dist 7 has their tourney at DL and Dist 8 has it at Langdon, then the region is at DL. I think that gives a little advantage to Dist 7 teams in the region tourney having been used to playing on that floor for 3 games already. For the girls, Dist 7 plays at NR and has played at FW in the past. Dist 8 has played at Rolla, Cando, and I believe Langdon, too. Then they play the region at DL. I think that's how it should be all the time.

[ndlionsfan]

I think Region 2 had a good setup that last couple years. Have Districts at Grafton and MSU, and then the region at the Betty.

[north_border_eagles2106]

Very well said CoachWest....I agree. I believe all region tourneys should be played at nuetral sites. I also think that district tourneys should try to be played at a class B school and preferably not on a nuetral site. I'll use region 4 boys for an example. I don't like the fact that Dist 7 has their tourney at DL and Dist 8 has it at Langdon, then the region is at DL. I think that gives a little advantage to Dist 7 teams in the region tourney having been used to playing on that floor for 3 games already. For the girls, Dist 7 plays at NR and has played at FW in the past. Dist 8 has played at Rolla, Cando, and I believe Langdon, too. Then they play the region at DL. I think that's how it should be all the time.

Yeah thats exactly what they just did in region II this year. District 4 had districts in Grafton while District was held in Mayville and now Regionals are in Grafton. Grand Forks is right about in the middle of Grafton and Mayville so it really was a perfect place to have regionals. Hopefully it gets changed after this year. After being in it as a player and a fan in the two years it was held there, the Betty is leaps and bounds better then Grafton or Mayville. For one you don't have to leave at 3 in the afternoon for your teams game at 8 just to make sure you can find a seat. When you get there you can sit comfortably and not have to cram way up into the nosebleed section. As far as the facility charge goes well it is going to benefit both districts. This year it's in Grafton so fans from all District 3 schools are going to have to drive an extra 30 or 40 miles instead of paying 2 more dollars at the door. If it goes back to mayville next year it'll be the same for District 4 towns.

[The Schwab]

I understand what your all saying about the facility....it is really head and shoulders above grafton and mayville......BUT.....you can't beat the atmosphere in mayville or grafton when people are packed in all screaming......dont kill the atmosphere

[scruffy]

Play the districts on a home floor but the regionals on a neutral one????????????????????????????? I say play the tournament in the largest arena in the vicinity. The NDHSAA has an obligation to allow as many people as possible the opportunity to see good basketball...

[#28]

hoopsattm i agree with u man that is where the region 2 toruney should be held it is a very nice place and a nutral place for the teams to play

[nc]

I agree the regionals should be played at a neutral site. The betty is an axcellent place for the regional tourney, it is neutral and the facility is awsome. So if people dont want regionals at the betty isnt it about time to have them at mayville? What do all of you think as Mayville hosting the regionals??

[Hinsa]

Mayville has become a little difficult to deal with in the last few years. They have forced the district/regional people to change their schedules to accommodate college games. The college knows when the tournaments are going to be held every year and if the college really wants to host the tournaments they should keep those dates open in their calendar.

Now having said that, I am a big booster of keeping cash from Class B fans flowing in Class B towns when possible. Mayville State and the town of Mayville could be more accommodating to the tournaments if they really want to host the tournaments. Little things like adding additional concession stands, livening up player introductions with music and lights, getting businesses involved with promotions for the fans, etc. all go a long way to making the tournament feel wanted. I'm not saying Mayville has never done this, but they seem to be pulling back on these things in the last few years.

Scheduling conflicts is why Mayville lost the girls district volleyball tournament this year.

[basketball20]

I played in the Betty last year for the girls region, and that is something that Mayville or Grafton can never comare to. The turnout was awesome and the place seemed to be packed. When you ran onto that floor for the first time you had chills from the atmosphere. To say that playing in front of a packed house in Mayville or Grafton is the same is a joke. There is no comparison in my opinion. So what if you have to pay a little more, the kids are never going to forget games that they played in the Betty, and I think that is what matters the most.

[hoopsattm]

I wonder what would happen if it was actually left up to the coaches of the teams involved? Supposedly it was, but I kind of doubt that many, if any of the coaches from the south are in favor of Grafton. I know most of the coaches from the north, and several are in favor of Forks. So I'm still somewhat puzzled that it made its way back to Grafton, home of one of the top-rated teams in the state. Mmmmm. Interesting. Atmosphere? Maybe the participants should have a say. I mean, as a high school kid, I would have much fonder memories of playing a big regional basketball game in the Betty rather than some place like Grafton or Mayville that I've already played in several times before. A tournament of this magnitude should not be played at the site of one of the participating teams, simple as that. Everyone knows it, just that some don't have the guts to admit it. So those people choose to come up with all the ridiculous reasons mentioned earlier.

[ndlionsfan]

I've coached teams in tourneys at Mayville and Grafton and I think Mayville did a best job at hosting than Grafton did.

[ndlionsfan]

Play the districts on a home floor but the regionals on a neutral one????????????????????????????? I say play the tournament in the largest arena in the vicinity. The NDHSAA has an obligation to allow as many people as possible the opportunity to see good basketball...

There aren't 16 nuetral sites for class B teams in the state. That's why it would work best to have district tourneys in the largest or nicest gym in that district and have regionals in the largest nuetral arena in the region. Yes, there will be home court advantage for one team in the district, but 4 teams get to go on to the regionals. If there's home court advantage in the region its a bit different because that could help the one team that gets to advance to state.

[toughregion2]

Grafton does a great job with the districs and regionals. I was very dissapointed in the atomosphere at the betty the first time they had region 2. Having said all the i was very impressed last year with the atomosphere in the betty. The only reason people have there undies in a pinch is because Grafton has a competetive team this year. I promise if Grafton was a below average team this wouldnt be a issue or as big of issue as it has become. The crowd makes home court advantage and i would have to say that just as many people from other teams show at region time so home court is null and void in my mind.......Why not have it in a smaller environment THATS WHAT CLASS B IS ALL ABOUT. I would rather play in a smaller full gym than a large half empty gym.

[PA42]

What was wrong with the atmosphere the first year? I feel that the betty did a good job. I also felt like mayville was a good spot to have regionals, but I do think grafton does an excellent job with tournaments.

[cubsfan]

My only problem with this is: isn't Mayville turn or at least a district 3 area turn to host it?

[north_border_eagles2106]

My only problem with this is: isn't Mayville turn or at least a district 3 area turn to host it?

Yes because in 2005 Grafton was the host and the next two years were in the betty. As far as the argument of a half-empty big arena goes, did you go to the Region II tournament the last two years? Considering the size of the Betty I would say it was quite full. I guarantee more people were in the Betty then in Grafton or Mayville because you can fit them comfortably. Why have it in a small gym that will reach maximum capacity every year and have to worry about leaving hours before your team plays just to get a decent spot. I played in the Region Championship game in Grafton in 2005 and the Betty in 2006 and I would much rather play in the Betty. Sure it's cool to see the place absolutely packed in Grafton during warm-ups but when you're on the court it doesn't do any more for you. The only fans you can hear are the ones up in the front and those seats in the betty were packed as well as the seats behind the baskets. The Betty is like I said earlier leaps and bounds better the Mayville State or Grafton as far as hosting.

[region 2 opinion]

I understand what your all saying about the facility....it is really head and shoulders above grafton and mayville......BUT.....you can't beat the atmosphere in mayville or grafton when people are packed in all screaming......dont kill the atmosphere

Hey Schwab!!! You r right!!!! The "Betty" is head and shoulders above both Grafton and Mayville. I don't know if you have been to the "Betty" during the regional but I have and the atmosphere is excellent there too. Neither Grafton or Mayville are any better than the "Betty" when it come to atmosphere, I have seen the atmosphere at all 3 facilities and none are any better then the "Betty" and the Betty is head and shoulders the best facility!!!!

[region 2 opinion]

I played in the Betty last year for the girls region, and that is something that Mayville or Grafton can never comare to. The turnout was awesome and the place seemed to be packed. When you ran onto that floor for the first time you had chills from the atmosphere. To say that playing in front of a packed house in Mayville or Grafton is the same is a joke. There is no comparison in my opinion. So what if you have to pay a little more, the kids are never going to forget games that they played in the Betty, and I think that is what matters the most.

Hey Girl!!!! We need more quotes from people like you that have played in all venues!!! You could not be more RIGHT!!!!! The big shots that got the Boys regional moved to Grafton were in it only for their own personal gain. One, who had been a big push for the "Betty" when he was with Dist 3 and now a very involved member with Dist 4 all of a sudden wants it in Grafton!!!! And his big side kick from St.Thomas has an even bigger interest in having it in Grafton!!! His son is the head coach at Grafton!!!! Anybody smelling something FISHEY yet!!!!!! This has been the biggest railroad job in Region 2 History!!!
You know,the ones who also should be called on the table should be the NDHSAA board of directors!!! Their biggest objective should be to generate $$$$$ for NDHSAA!!!! The past years the Region 2 tournament has generated huge money at the Betty!! Between the Boys and the Girls tournaments the last few years, the tournaments at the "Betty" have produced between $5000 and $6000 dollars more revenue per year then Grafton or Mayville!!! Is the NDHSAA willing to lose $5000.00 to $6000.00 dollars/year just to satisfy one of their members and his sidekick!!! WOW!!!! If they are, we have some problems going on here!!!! I think most sports in N.D. are losing $$$$$, why would we let NDHSAA throw $5000 to $6000 away/year to let their chosen few have their tournament in Grafton!!! What kind of message are we sending here!!!!! Anyone dare to respond!!!!

[region 2 opinion]

My only problem with this is: isn't Mayville turn or at least a district 3 area turn to host it?

Yes, it is their turn if we are taking turns!!!!

[region 2 opinion]

Grafton does a great job with the districs and regionals. I was very dissapointed in the atomosphere at the betty the first time they had region 2. Having said all the i was very impressed last year with the atomosphere in the betty. The only reason people have there undies in a pinch is because Grafton has a competetive team this year. I promise if Grafton was a below average team this wouldnt be a issue or as big of issue as it has become. The crowd makes home court advantage and i would have to say that just as many people from other teams show at region time so home court is null and void in my mind.......Why not have it in a smaller environment THATS WHAT CLASS B IS ALL ABOUT. I would rather play in a smaller full gym than a large half empty gym.

You will never see the "Betty" half empty!!! It is the perfect place for region 2!!!

[region 2 opinion]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Keep the region tournaments in class B towns, whenever possible.

Why would anybody feel that way???? Give me some kinda reason you would want that??? Let's make things fair here!!!

[hoopsattm]

In response to "toughregion2", yes I do agree people are a little more miffed about the whole subject because Grafton has a very good team this year. That's even more of a reason not to have it there. A home court crowd indeed is a big advantage, and at that tournament, every participant will have their fair share of fans. However, don't you think Grafton has just a slight advantage playing in the facility they play half their games and practice on every day? I always felt more comfortable playing at home. Plus, the real problem is what has been stated earlier and several times. HOW it all happened. It was NOT decided by a vote by the coaches. Sounds like the decision was made by 2-3 people, none of which are coaches, for personal reasons. I find it very sad that people in a position of leadership would twist a situation like this for their own benefit. Do we teach our children, our grandchildren, to be deceitful just to get ahead?