Why are some schools always good while others struggle every

[the low down]

what would ever give that away...;)

[Wild Wolves]

I think that for the small towns parents play as big a role as the coaches and players.  I remember sitting down with my dad and being askedvery straightforward, " What do you hope to accomplish as an athlete?"

I didn't have an answer (stuff him off), but he said go write it down.

After a couple of days I had a list.  Make it to state in each of the sports.  Be a team captain as a senior in at least one sport.  Didn't acheive all of the goals but I got pretty close.  If i had made varsity BB as a freshman I would have gone to state in BB.  Really the only disappointment today is track, wish I wouled have taken it more seriously.

The other thing parents do is support the programs (pay for camps, gas to get to practice, shoes, clothes, spending money etc...) Really if you are in sports it might be a good idea to thank your parents for the opportunity to compete.

[observer]

Size of the school isn't enough.  There has to be an attitude of wanting to play your best, there has to  be a dedicated coach who loves the sport and the kids and is doing things to improve the overall program.  A fan once complained to me about the parochial schools recruiting and that that wasn't fair.  My reply it wasn't fair that the parochial schools cared enough to hire good coaches.  And by the way, the parochial school itself may not recruit but I think there are parents and kids that talk plenty to help "recruit" players to the their school.  That even happens in neighboring Class B schools now with open enrollment.

[BB11]

This is a very good question and some have mentioned many of the things I wished too.
But #1 - it takes coaching - someone said - if you look at schools with low turnover in the coaching ranks - they usually have success. Examples - Fridley in Watford FB - Oksendahl - was in Cavalier FB and Baseball - Brackenberry - MLS girls BB - Carr - Linton BB - Beyer- Hillsboro BB - Hunskor - Newburg BB etc. These coaches have the attitude to build a program with what they want to accomplish - the players MUST BUY IN to this idea or they know they won't play.

#2 - Takes athletes - a good coach can make a so-so athlete a good player - and make a good athlete a great player - BUT the kids have to want to put in the work and the time. Look at Dickinson Trinity - they don't have the best athletes - they really don't - but they bought into Coach Grinnsteiner's program - they saw the success of the earlier teams, and they want that success to continue - so they work their butts off at achieving it.

#3 - Parents/Community - have to have some backing with what a coach is trying to do - and help their kids accomplish their goals by paying for camps - off-season programs - etc. AND BY NOT TRYING TO BE A COACH AT HOME! If the majority of the parents and community members let the kids play and the coaches coach - things will go much smoother in the long run.
NDinPhx asked - "How can you start" - That is a good question - it starts with the COACH. They have to SELL to their players that what they want them to do in-season and out-of-season will help them be successful. Once a group buys into it, and has some success the others will follow. If a group buys into it, and they are not successful the coach has to take a different approach with the next group. If players do not buy into a coaches system and are not successful - that might prompt the next group to say - "Hey lets give this coach a chance and do what he says." Coaches are salespeople. They have to sell themselves to the public, and their players. Once everyone is on the same page - that's when you start having some winning teams.
Sorry this got a little long - but that is what I have observed over my few decades watching Class B sports.

[Indians Alumni]

Alot has to do with the community!  Some Communities do not like outsiders coming in and coaching.  Another issue is money!  Does the school have enough money to bring in the talent needed to turn around a program!  It also comes down to coaching!  Does the coach have the means of making a successful program? 

 

[nativegolfer]

Alot has to do with the community!  Some Communities do not like outsiders coming in and coaching.  Another issue is money!  Does the school have enough money to bring in the talent needed to turn around a program!  It also comes down to coaching!  Does the coach have the means of making a successful program? 

 

What do you mean by bring in the talent?

[always a sports season]

Alot has to do with the community!  Some Communities do not like outsiders coming in and coaching.  Another issue is money!  Does the school have enough money to bring in the talent needed to turn around a program!  It also comes down to coaching!  Does the coach have the means of making a successful program? 

 

In some communities the coach has to be a real PR person.  Coaches also have to let their philosophy be known and it needs to match the community's philosophy.  In some communities there is a such an attitude of seniors have to have the playing time that the coach takes a big risk when a younger player is allowed to play.  If a kid is big and gets to play when he's younger the coach will get a break.  But if a kid is a guard and younger, they end up waiting their turn and their potential is never fully developed.  I feel bad for those kids who don't get the  same opportunities as those kids who have good coaches.

[Indians Alumni]

Alot has to do with the community!  Some Communities do not like outsiders coming in and coaching.  Another issue is money!  Does the school have enough money to bring in the talent needed to turn around a program!  It also comes down to coaching!  Does the coach have the means of making a successful program? 

 

What do you mean by bring in the talent?

I should have made it clear, I mean talented coaches! 

[bball rules]

While I agree with you that some communities have an attitude about "senior rights",  I won't give a coach any break there.  I expect the coach to make the best choices for the positions he has available, and field the most competitive team possible.  When the person in authority (the coach) doesn't do that, he compromises the entire team.  How do you instill the work ethic in your players to work hard and do their best if that same philosophy doesn't start at the top?  It's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.

[BigBalla]

I agree with that to some extent but even at big schools, there can be classes that just flat out don't have talent. It's the work in offseason, and coaches' dedication that rebuild great programs.

[ndfbfan]

While I agree with you that some communities have an attitude about "senior rights",  I won't give a coach any break there.  I expect the coach to make the best choices for the positions he has available, and field the most competitive team possible.  When the person in authority (the coach) doesn't do that, he compromises the entire team.  How do you instill the work ethic in your players to work hard and do their best if that same philosophy doesn't start at the top?  It's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.

Are you an current athlete?? How much do you know about coaching?? I'm not trying to put you down, I'm asking a question. The reason? Because there are numerous good coaches who have made the decision to play the best players and as a result, are watching h.s. sports from the sidelines. I know this for fact. This isn't college or pro. This is high school, and sometimes making decisions like playing the best players can lead to your resignation. Fact of life whether you believe it or not.

[run-n-gun]

I think alot of it has to do with the older players on the team creating a winning atmoshere in their school. So when they leave the younger players come in they have the same sense of being great.

[grizz]

I think alot of it has to do with the older players on the team creating a winning atmoshere in their school. So when they leave the younger players come in they have the same sense of being great.

100% true. I know as I was growing up and watching the Titans, I wanted to be apart of that. I used to think of those guys as superstars man. No one wants to be known as "the class who failed".

[scruffy]

There's nothing like tradition.  It can be tore apart in a year or two but it takes YEARS to establish....

[bball rules]

I'm not really sure what you are trying to say ndbbfan... "sometimes making decisions like playing the best players can lead to your resignation", are you saying that coaches should coach to the expectation of those that are the most vocal, and forget about playing to win?  In my opinion, no sport is worth playing unless you are playing to win.  I'm not saying that you have to win,  I'm saying that when the game is over, you should feel that you gave it your best.  I don't know how you can feel that way if you know you have left one of your more talented athletes sit on the bench. 

[Wild Wolves]

While I agree with you that some communities have an attitude about "senior rights",  I won't give a coach any break there.  I expect the coach to make the best choices for the positions he has available, and field the most competitive team possible.  When the person in authority (the coach) doesn't do that, he compromises the entire team.  How do you instill the work ethic in your players to work hard and do their best if that same philosophy doesn't start at the top?  It's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.

Are you an current athlete?? How much do you know about coaching?? I'm not trying to put you down, I'm asking a question. The reason? Because there are numerous good coaches who have made the decision to play the best players and as a result, are watching h.s. sports from the sidelines. I know this for fact. This isn't college or pro. This is high school, and sometimes making decisions like playing the best players can lead to your resignation. Fact of life whether you believe it or not.

I certainly would not want to coach intermurals, and if I had to play kids just because they were seniors, I wouldn't do it, and I would look for another job.  When I have had older players who work hard and are positive members of the team I may start them over a more talented player but the later will have more actual playing time.

[always a sports season]

I'm not really sure what you are trying to say ndbbfan... "sometimes making decisions like playing the best players can lead to your resignation", are you saying that coaches should coach to the expectation of those that are the most vocal, and forget about playing to win?  In my opinion, no sport is worth playing unless you are playing to win.  I'm not saying that you have to win,  I'm saying that when the game is over, you should feel that you gave it your best.  I don't know how you can feel that way if you know you have left one of your more talented athletes sit on the bench. 

Oh , I know it happens! And it feels crappy to most of the players.   I've seen good players get overlooked so the coach can keep vocal parents quieter.  And I say quieter because those parents are still unhappy because the coach hasn't miraculously made their child who is only mediocre in athletic ability a star athlete.  That always seems to be the coach's fault in the parent's eyes.

[always a sports season]

While I agree with you that some communities have an attitude about "senior rights",  I won't give a coach any break there.  I expect the coach to make the best choices for the positions he has available, and field the most competitive team possible.  When the person in authority (the coach) doesn't do that, he compromises the entire team.  How do you instill the work ethic in your players to work hard and do their best if that same philosophy doesn't start at the top?  It's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.

You're right  - it's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.  But coaches do it or lose their jobs.  School boards listen to the most vocal people.  They generally don't support their coaches because they just want the problem gone.  Check out schools that have a big turnover of coaches or look at the schools that have fired coaches, hired a new one that's stayed but still isn't that successful but if the vocal parents's kids are playing - then it seems to be okay.

[bball rules]

While I agree with you that some communities have an attitude about "senior rights",  I won't give a coach any break there.  I expect the coach to make the best choices for the positions he has available, and field the most competitive team possible.  When the person in authority (the coach) doesn't do that, he compromises the entire team.  How do you instill the work ethic in your players to work hard and do their best if that same philosophy doesn't start at the top?  It's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.

You're right  - it's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.  But coaches do it or lose their jobs.  School boards listen to the most vocal people.  They generally don't support their coaches because they just want the problem gone.  Check out schools that have a big turnover of coaches or look at the schools that have fired coaches, hired a new one that's stayed but still isn't that successful but if the vocal parents's kids are playing - then it seems to be okay.

I don't know where you are from, but in our area, the school boards won't do anything about a coach unless there are signed complaints about him.  We have a couple of coaches that are less than satisfactory as far as the community is concerned, however, these coaches are also the athlete's teachers, so no one is really willing to make any formal complaints.  Incidently, while the community, as a whole, has been dissatisfied, the varsity head coaches have remained unchanged for about 10 years.  We usually hear about coaching being a thankless job (i couldn't argue that) and the pay is inadequate for the hours (i couldn't argue that either), but, on the other hand, no one is leaving.  I really don't mean this to be a bashing of the coaching profession, but they have a unique classroom environment, and I don't always feel the things to be learned are being taught.

[Wild Wolves]

By things to be learned, do you mean classroom, life or court/field?

[bball rules]

By things to be learned, do you mean classroom, life or court/field?

A mixture of life and court.  Many times, to be successful in life, you need to be able to adapt to the people around you.  You may have to change your presentation half way thru it, because you see that it is not being well received or understood.  You need to be well prepared for a variety of situations.  Likewise on a basketball court. You won't be successful if you only play one kind of defense, you won't be successful if you only have one or two offensive plays.  If you have some talented athletes, they will have some success, but it will end when you meet tougher competition.  The successful teams have been well coached in all areas of the game.Sometimes you have an athlete that is hoping to play his sport in college.  Many won't get the chance because they simply don't have the abillity.  Those that do, should be taught all the tools they need to be successful...........whether they work to develop them is up to them. 

[always a sports season]

By things to be learned, do you mean classroom, life or court/field?

A mixture of life and court.  Many times, to be successful in life, you need to be able to adapt to the people around you.  You may have to change your presentation half way thru it, because you see that it is not being well received or understood.  You need to be well prepared for a variety of situations.  Likewise on a basketball court. You won't be successful if you only play one kind of defense, you won't be successful if you only have one or two offensive plays.  If you have some talented athletes, they will have some success, but it will end when you meet tougher competition.  The successful teams have been well coached in all areas of the game.Sometimes you have an athlete that is hoping to play his sport in college.  Many won't get the chance because they simply don't have the abillity.  Those that do, should be taught all the tools they need to be successful...........whether they work to develop them is up to them. 

"Those that do, should be taught all the tools they need to be successful"  You are really right there.  And that's what's so unfortunate - an athlete in small schools with weaker coaches really miss out.

[always a sports season]

While I agree with you that some communities have an attitude about "senior rights",  I won't give a coach any break there.  I expect the coach to make the best choices for the positions he has available, and field the most competitive team possible.  When the person in authority (the coach) doesn't do that, he compromises the entire team.  How do you instill the work ethic in your players to work hard and do their best if that same philosophy doesn't start at the top?  It's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.

So what are your thoughts about Wahpeton's basketball coach being fired?  One of the reasons given was that he played younger players. 

[cdub1]

While I agree with you that some communities have an attitude about "senior rights",  I won't give a coach any break there.  I expect the coach to make the best choices for the positions he has available, and field the most competitive team possible.  When the person in authority (the coach) doesn't do that, he compromises the entire team.  How do you instill the work ethic in your players to work hard and do their best if that same philosophy doesn't start at the top?  It's difficult to be a fan and see the potential that isn't being recognized.

So what are your thoughts about Wahpeton's basketball coach being fired?  One of the reasons given was that he played younger players. 

that is trash only word to describe that trash

[lightning]

it is simple the reason some schools are good year after year. COACHING...EX. Linton dan carr is there he is amazing truly