Region 2

Class B Boys
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Re: Region 2

Postby classB4ever » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:38 am

the old guy wrote:"Basketball is much like church, many attend, few understand."

Bob Knight


Thank you for that. Great quote and so true.

For some of you newer posters, there are a number of threads from over the years that discuss rules, myths, etc. if you want to do some digging.
Some of the most misinterpreted by the fans:
1. There is no infraction in the rule book for over the back. It is a push.
2. When grabbing a loose ball and going to the floor, you can slide the entire length of the floor while gaining control and there is no violation. Once your body comes to a stop, you have established your pivot. At this point, you cannot roll over, get to your knees, etc. or you have changed your pivot and have now traveled. If you have possession and go to the floor, you have changed your pivot and committed a violation. It is all about where/when possession was gained.

Here are a couple of questions:
1. Player A has possession of the ball and loses balance. While holding ball with both hands, player makes contact with ball to floor to regain balance and stands back up. (Player never moves either foot or changes pivot, simply falls forward, regains balance with aid of ball and stands back up). Is this a violation?
2. Player A is dribbling the ball and traps the ball on their leg on the way down during the dribble. Does it matter whether or not the ball comes to a complete stop while being trapped against the leg during the dribble? Is there a violation in either instance?

Back to the games: The seeding held court. Thought that Grafton might pull an upset on MPCG. Should be a great atmosphere tonight.
Last edited by classB4ever on Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Region 2

Postby RedDirtFan » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:43 am

1. If the player clearly possesses the ball when he loses both of his feet, I believe it's a travel.

2. Technically, I believe that's an illegal dribble, but I think officials would err on the side of caution and be positive they saw the ball stop moving completely before blowing the whistle.
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Re: Region 2

Postby d_fense » Tue Mar 10, 2015 11:54 am

classB4ever wrote:
the old guy wrote:"Basketball is much like church, many attend, few understand."

Bob Knight


Thank you for that. Great quote and so true.

For some of you newer posters, there are a number of threads from over the years that discuss rules, myths, etc. if you want to do some digging.
Some of the most misinterpreted by the fans:
1. There is no infraction in the rule book for over the back. It is a push.
2. When grabbing a loose ball and going to the floor, you can slide the entire length of the floor while gaining control and there is no violation. Once your body comes to a stop, you have established your pivot. At this point, you cannot roll over, get to your knees, etc. or you have changed your pivot and have now traveled. If you have possession and go to the floor, you have changed your pivot and committed a violation. It is all about where/when possession was gained.

Here are a couple of questions:
1. Player A has possession of the ball and loses balance. While holding ball with both hands, player makes contact with ball to floor to regain balance and stands back up. (Player never moves either foot or changes pivot, simply falls forward, regains balance with aid of ball and stands back up). Is this a violation?
2. Player A is dribbling the ball and traps the ball on their leg on the way down during the dribble. Does it matter whether or not the ball comes to a complete stop while being trapped against the leg during the dribble? Is there a violation in either instance?

Back to the games: The seeding held court. Thought that Grafton might pull an upset on MPCG. Should be a great atmosphere tonight.


In regards to your first question, you are leaving out an important point. Did he dribble the ball before picking it up and loosing his balance? If so, the fall and catching balance with the ball would be considered a second dribble and be called a double dribble. If they had not dribbled yet, they may catch their balance with the ball. However, it counted as a dribble, so it they dribble again it would be a double dribble.
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Re: Region 2

Postby classB4ever » Tue Mar 10, 2015 12:19 pm

d_fense wrote:In regards to your first question, you are leaving out an important point. Did he dribble the ball before picking it up and loosing his balance? If so, the fall and catching balance with the ball would be considered a second dribble and be called a double dribble. If they had not dribbled yet, they may catch their balance with the ball. However, it counted as a dribble, so it they dribble again it would be a double dribble.


Doesn't matter. It is not considered a dribble when holding the ball and touching it to the floor once or more than once.
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Re: Region 2

Postby winner-within » Tue Mar 10, 2015 12:28 pm

I personally dont think any call made yesterday changes anything on outcome of day one @ the Betty
what was thought to be by many an even steven day of ball turned out to be very predictable minuets into each game except one....I really enjoyed Henningsgards play to mount the comeback....he's very cool under pressure (although took till second half to gain his composure)....Engel fought hard to try keep that game a Griggs victory....but with that said lets keep the thread Region 2 and start a new one for a ref clinic...

Who out there wants a new representative for the region to go to state and why?

I want the best team to go.... :D
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Re: Region 2

Postby Flying Wallenda » Tue Mar 10, 2015 1:32 pm

Cavalier 54-46 over HCV
HN 50-49 over MPCG
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Re: Region 2

Postby RedDirtFan » Tue Mar 10, 2015 3:51 pm

winner-within wrote:I personally dont think any call made yesterday changes anything on outcome of day one @ the Betty
what was thought to be by many an even steven day of ball turned out to be very predictable minuets into each game except one....I really enjoyed Henningsgards play to mount the comeback....he's very cool under pressure (although took till second half to gain his composure)....Engel fought hard to try keep that game a Griggs victory....but with that said lets keep the thread Region 2 and start a new one for a ref clinic...

Who out there wants a new representative for the region to go to state and why?

I want the best team to go.... :D


Like I said, the game got out of hand and maybe would have anyway. That doesn't change the fact that a very important player was taken away from one team by applying fouls to the wrong player. Twice. There undoubtedly were fouls on each play, but the wrong number was reported both times, putting a great defensive player on the bench with 6 minutes left in the second. It happened just before the other team broke it open and it played a part in the huge momentum swing.

The issue isn't that it affected the outcome of the game so much as it was a mistake that shouldn't happen in the first place.

All things considered, I'll put this issue to bed. If you're interested in these plays, the webcast link is posted on page 2 and right after that I listed the times when each incident happened. Take a look if you want, but this'll be my last post on the subject. I didn't mean to derail this thread.

Good look to Cavalier, HCV, MPCG, and Hatton-Northwood. May the best team win, may everyone escape the tournament healthy, and may Tuesday and Thursday have nights filled with great basketball.

My picks for tonight: Cavalier and Hatton-Northwood. I expect both to be close so long as HCV and MPCG don't continue to have struggles early on games.
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Re: Region 2

Postby winner-within » Wed Mar 11, 2015 9:38 am

I see your point reddirt, and I know that this happens....happened to me in the grand am one year....gave 2 of my brothers fouls to me and I sat with 5.....The Refs are supposed to be fair and persistence....but I think they actually get nervous in big games as well.....In Region 2, I dont think there is one crowd any worse than the next crowd when it comes to reacting to a questionable call...Thats Basketball!! and one of the aspects I love about it....passion and sports must go together or there is no reason to play the game IMO

Robbins sat with 3 fouls with 5 mins to go in the second quarter last night...ouch! I was worried.....good finish for the Brown Kid and great Victory for the Tornadoes, congrats!.....hats off to HCV they have a young team and a great future!!....congrats to MPCG for the gritty comeback Wow, what a finish... :D
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Re: Region 2

Postby RedDirtFan » Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:25 pm

Yeah, HCV will be very good next year. I think that, in this tournament, Cavalier may have beaten the 2 front runners for next season, barring injury.

I think Cavalier takes the region on Thursday. They're so well-coached. I'd say a good measuring stick for coaching is in-game adjustments. Cavalier's staff seems to excel at that.
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Re: Region 2

Postby winner-within » Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:58 pm

RedDirtFan wrote:Yeah, HCV will be very good next year. I think that, in this tournament, Cavalier may have beaten the 2 front runners for next season, barring injury.

I think Cavalier takes the region on Thursday. They're so well-coached. I'd say a good measuring stick for [color=#004040]coaching is in-game adjustments[/color]. Cavalier's staff seems to excel at that.


Its funny you say that because I was talking to a co-worker today saying Coach Laxdal had waltzed into some serious talent when he came in and done great with it with an undefeated season vs ND opponents one of the seasons and such and making State both years....this season is different because he has had to structure way more of a game plan due to the equality of the Region in general....I also believe the super region format feeds a coach better with what to expect across the region....with that said he is an outstanding scouter and he absorbs real well...also there are some great coaches throughout the region so he has to be on his game and he is.....MPCG will be a tough opponent and the whole world knows this :) we dont have to tell anybody.... :D........
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Re: Region 2

Postby vikingman » Fri Mar 13, 2015 9:50 am

How does Region 2 pay for the webcasting? Does each school pay an equal amount or do they just take it out of attendance receipts?
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Re: Region 2

Postby SEC » Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:17 am

RedDirtFan wrote:Yeah, HCV will be very good next year. I think that, in this tournament, Cavalier may have beaten the 2 front runners for next season, barring injury.

I think Cavalier takes the region on Thursday. They're so well-coached. I'd say a good measuring stick for coaching is in-game adjustments. Cavalier's staff seems to excel at that.

You seem to be great at picking MPCG basketball games, be sure to pick Oak Grove in the first round of state (I do expect OG to win). I think you saw the difference between a well coached and a more athletically superior team on Thursday. If you have a lot of coaches the athletes cavalier has had the past couple of years and they would do just as well if not better than Bryce has. He got out coached in the second half of the region title game.
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Re: Region 2

Postby Sticks11 » Sun Mar 15, 2015 7:45 am

I'd like to credit MPCG's kids and coaches with the win more than I want to blame it on lack there of from Cavalier.
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Re: Region 2

Postby oil-rigger66 » Mon Mar 16, 2015 4:47 pm

Sticks11 wrote:I'd like to credit MPCG's kids and coaches with the win more than I want to blame it on lack there of from Cavalier.


So you want to credit the MPCG's kids and coaches more than blame it on the lack of coaching from Cavalier? Not sure what you are implying. Do you think Cavalier lacks some coaching ability?
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Re: Region 2

Postby oil-rigger66 » Mon Mar 16, 2015 5:07 pm

And also to SEC, yes if you have talent on a team anyone can jump in and take credit for the talent, but I don't believe that's the case here. Yes, cavalier was the top dog at the beginning of the season and was the favorite, but it appeared to me that Cavalier didn't know how to put their talent together until mid-season when they started playing some real ball as a team. During the region championship, I don't believe Laxdal got out coached. The boys couldn't get the ball in the hoop, and they had no answer to MPCG's small fourth quarter run of points. It baffles me that one can say a coach can jump in and do a better job than him. Lets be honest, if the final score was in favor of cavalier, who would have brought home coach of the year? But big credit to MPCG for shutting down cavalier that second half and best of luck at the "B". Represent region 2 to the best of your ability and enjoy it!
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Re: Region 2

Postby Sticks11 » Tue Mar 17, 2015 7:28 pm

oil-rigger66 wrote:
Sticks11 wrote:I'd like to credit MPCG's kids and coaches with the win more than I want to blame it on lack there of from Cavalier.


So you want to credit the MPCG's kids and coaches more than blame it on the lack of coaching from Cavalier? Not sure what you are implying. Do you think Cavalier lacks some coaching ability?


I was referencing a previous post from SEC in this thread. What I meant was what happens on the court isn't always how the coach wants it to go. It isn't how they prepared for it or it isn't what they said in a timeout. It's just what happens. Cavalier scores 1 in the fourth. That's what I'm saying, I can't say they got out coached.
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Re: Region 2

Postby HufflePuff » Wed Mar 18, 2015 1:57 pm

I have to agree with Sticks 11. No matter how much a coach prepares his players for a game, if the players don't execute the game plan then it isn't the coaches fault. I think that is what happened in this case. How often do you see a team score 1 point in a quarter? Not often. They got some great look but just could not finish around the basketball. Best of luck to MPCG!
I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. 26 times, I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed. -Michael Jordan
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Re: Region 2

Postby winner-within » Wed Mar 18, 2015 3:07 pm

HufflePuff wrote:I have to agree with Sticks 11. No matter how much a coach prepares his players for a game, if the players don't execute the game plan then it isn't the coaches fault. I think that is what happened in this case. How often do you see a team score 1 point in a quarter? Not often. They got some great look but just could not finish around the basketball. Best of luck to MPCG!



Hence my theory on what wins Region 2....Offense

A coach cant run out and make the shot
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