Waking Up Bishop Ryan

[Run4Fun2009]

I would agree that income is not the main factor in putting a child in a private school....but the budget of the school itself is (I would bet) noticeably different
these kids get the best of the best
access to facilities alone is huge, any kid that sets any scoring record in ND (private or public) has had much more access to a gym than Jon Doe who couldn't get in a gym if he tried to.

It still takes tradition and a good club though

I hope by that you mean that the public school has an overabundance of dollars compared to the private school. If you meant it the other way around you would be quite inaccurate. Private Schools often operate with 1/2 to 2/3 the budget a similar sized public school does.

I couldn't agree with you more about tradition and program.

administrators and staff make alot less??

Doesn't mean the money goes straight to athletics. I know at my former school it went to Music more than athletics.

[Flip]

There was a documentary(?) on ESPN about St. Anthony's HS in NJ where Bobby Hurley coaches and if I remember correctly they didn't have anything extravagant at that school.

[winner-within]

Like I told the Priest when he said "taking kids to a grade school tournament on the weekend is total nonsense" I said, "well they must have found someway to fit it in for LeBron" @ St. Vincent – St. Mary High School is a private, coed, Catholic high school located in Akron, Ohio......

Bottom line? winning in everything is everything at a Private...no quetions

[Run4Fun2009]

Like I told the Priest when he said "taking kids to a grade school tournament on the weekend is total nonsense" I said, "well they must have found someway to fit it in for LeBron" @ St. Vincent – St. Mary High School is a private, coed, Catholic high school located in Akron, Ohio......

Bottom line? winning in everything is everything at a Private...no questions

That's your opinion...

[Baller]

I would agree that income is not the main factor in putting a child in a private school....but the budget of the school itself is (I would bet) noticeably different
these kids get the best of the best
access to facilities alone is huge, any kid that sets any scoring record in ND (private or public) has had much more access to a gym than Jon Doe who couldn't get in a gym if he tried to.

It still takes tradition and a good club though

I hope by that you mean that the public school has an overabundance of dollars compared to the private school. If you meant it the other way around you would be quite inaccurate. Private Schools often operate with 1/2 to 2/3 the budget a similar sized public school does.

I couldn't agree with you more about tradition and program.

administrators and staff make alot less??

yes....a private school teacher makes about $12000 less than a public school teacher. Admins almost $35000 less and in most private schools teachers may not receive retirement benefits. That is why many teachers leave the private schools to teach in a public school

[winner-within]

Well money isnt everything....sometimes the pros out way the cons....very few special needs students, hand picked kids, more control in the classroom etc etc...and obviously the money must be managed better

[Sportsrube]

Most private schools also do not accept students with special needs, which is a large part of most public school budgets. Public schools must take any student in their district, regardless of abilities or disabilities while private schools do not have to, and in most cases (to my knowledge) don't accept those students with severe (expensive) disabilities. Some public schools use almost 25 - 30% of their total budgets on special needs kids.

[Indy5]

I'll use Minot as the example since I am more familar with that. Minot High is a very good scool system. Facilities and things handed to kids far outweigh Bishop Ryan's. They obviously offer a much more wide array of classes. The only drawback as to why I wouldn't want to send my kids there is how huge the school is. I've only been around the middle schools, but they are zoos with that many kids.

As for the Kubic case. I know of some kids who live in Surrey. They attend Bishop Ryan because their parents work there. I don't know if thats true in Kubic's case, but just a possiblity to consider.

Balla45 hit the nail on the head as to the "competitive advantage" that privates have. They do technically recruit becasue as I've said before they are running out of kids and want anyone they can get but they are not out finding talented athletes and persuading them to come.

[bison football73]

Just gonna say that in Trinity's case that I played against all of their seniors in jh with the exception of Kubik. I also don't remember Kubik playing for Killdeer's jh team either though.

[chargers]

Just gonna say that in Trinity's case that I played against all of their seniors in jh with the exception of Kubik. I also don't remember Kubik playing for Killdeer's jh team either though.

From what I was told he lives in Manning, ND. That is 8 miles from Killdeer. I was also told he moved there his freshman year along with his older brother who played offensive line for Trinity.

[playedalittle]

I am not sure that this discussion is as much about private schools and what they offer, but rather exposure and the opportunity to be part of a successful program that may allow the student athlete to be recruited.

The recruiting point on private vs. public is really moot, all coaches recruit, I repeat, all coaches recruit.
That is true of at all levels.
It may not be active with scholarship offers, or offers of playing time, or what have you, but all coaches recruit.

Todays kids are all about the exposure. This web site is a mild example of the electronic buzz/frenzy that happens today. Why do they play AAU in the summer? To get better? I would argue that point till the cows come home. Kids and the parents that drive the dirty little buggers, are all about getting to the next level. My, Me, My, Me, My Kid.

With ESPN, facebook, Twitter...SPorts have left the simple pleasure and treasure of local rivalries, family traditions, storied coaches, and are jumping into the instant gratification of the previous mentioned electronic media and AAU gamesgamesgamesgamesgamesgamesgamesgamesgamesgamesgamesgames.
Have any of you looked at the cost of just the shoes alone today costs. I can here my dad (enjoying this nonsense in heaven) telling me to get 2 pairs of the new $160 Nikes.

It is a big and instant world. Where are the best athletes in ND going? UND, SU, Boise State????
Look at the state of our college programs? Our 2 largest schools cant even get together to play against each other anymore. The former NAIA conference now in shambles. Some schools playing Division 2 and some in NAIA. Ask Mary College and Dickinson how that is going.

This may have been more of a rant than intended. But somehow I want to get back to the good old days, lets have Jim Adelson (Sp) and Russ Smith talk about the teams.

A good friend of mine just told me about a book called "Blind Your Ponies"

I highly recommend it.
Brings back the good old days.

Not much else to do when you retire. Now I gotta go and raise some money for my sons AAU team. They need 2 new sets of uniforms you know. Your all invited to his 9th birthday party next week.

[Hinsa]

Awesome post about the good old days. I too question how much kids learn playing AAU ball. They do play lots of games, but are they developing fundamental skills or just playing lots of games?

Balla, care to chime in on this? Do you have time to teach fundamentals or is it all about lots of games?

[balla45]

I'm not even going to go in depth as to how much this p*sses me off.

Here are some of my thoughts.

My program ran workouts, twice a day, whenever we were not on the road, all summer.

I personally did at least 40 individual workouts with Tyler Rudolph, Alex Quist, Robert Hutchins, Ben Weisbeck, Scott Nagel, Darius Sparks, Jayden Ferguson, and others.

We have now added two Fargo area coaches to our staff as we expand east, who will also be conducting workouts.

I've personally coached the #1, #2, #4, #5, #6, #10, and #11 scorers in the WDA, #2, #3, #6, #9, #10, #11 rebounders in the WDA, as well as #1, #4, #5, #7, #9, #10, #11, #14, and #15 field goal percentage guys in the WDA, and the #2, #4, #5, and #6 three point percentage guys in the WDA, all over 40%.

Our Century guys, Tyler Rudolph, Alex Quist, Robert Hutchins, Ramey Schatz, and Dalton Feeney have 2 losses in North Dakota, both to our Saint Mary's guys, Ben Weisbeck, Scott Nagel, and Darius Sparks.

Ferguson has had multiple games of over 25 points and over 15 rebounds for Williston, even though he is the only threat on his team.

James Richman of Maple Valley averaged 5 points and 4 rebounds last year, he is now averaging 19 points and 11 rebounds this year. I feel it is safe to say he improved.

Tyler Rudolph averaged 6 and 3 last year. He's averaging 14.8 and 8.5 this year. I feel it is safe to say that he improved.

Taylor Krenz is about to become his school's all time leading scorer, in by far, his most productive season. They just won their District Tournament too. Yeah, he says that the 9:00 a.m. defensive workouts and ball handling workouts on Tuesdays and Thursdays really helped him.

Of our 14u team last year (9 current freshman and 1 8th grader) 6 of the 8 Class A kids got moved up to jv as freshmen, 1 plays varsity, and 1 just had a 34 point 19 rebound game in freshman basketball last Friday. The other, Casey Walcker is a solid varsity contributor for undefeated Beulah.

One of our girls players opened up her season with 38 points, which is top 5 all time in Class A, if I am not mistaken. I'm not even going to begin to discuss how well the girls have been playing this year.

Weisbeck averaged 4 points a game as a freshman, played a summer with us, then was the only Class A All State sophomore, and will likely be All State for the rest of his career, and already has received a full ride offer to play in college. Nagel did not get on the court as a freshman. He played with us for a summer, then he ends up being All Conference as a sophomore, on a team that brought back 3 starters. Rudolph had 0 double doubles as a sophomore, in games within 10 points this season, he is averaging 17 points and 13 rebounds. I tend to think doing post workouts all summer with Jayden Ferguson and James Richman really helped him improve his game.

Kids do not just play for us to play in a bunch of games. They play because they know we are going to do everything possible to squeeze as much potential out of them as we can. Coaches do not come to games for teams that don't have good players. Exposure is useless if you are not good enough to play for the coaches you are exposed to. It doesn't matter if you play in a tournament where a bunch of D1 coaches make appearances, if you are not good enough to play there, they will not want you.

And to be fair and not just brag up my program, I had ZERO EDC boys last year. Every one of the top 10 scorers in the EDC played for ECI or Dakota Pride last summer.

[Sportsrube]

Well answered balla 45. I get tired of the "good old days" arguement (and I have been around for quite a while) and how much better things were "back then". We played in cold, underlit gyms in short shorts with crappy canvas tennis shoes - yeah for the "good old days"! The only way you get better at something is to work at it, anytime you have a ball in your hand you have a chance to get better. Kids need to learn to compete, not just have things handed to them.

[winner-within]

The only thing good about the good old days?? ..is they are gone...

There are still gyms and locker rooms and programs that are stuck in past

The one thing I will say is some of the summerball puts players ahead of pack to the point they get frustrated when they have to resort back to their school and play with their real team.....they also learn each others game and that makes it more comfortable when they meet up again in the school year.

[rock83]

If the kids play they will improve, whether it is with you or in their hometown gym.

[balla45]

We might be overestimating our importance! If the kids play they will improve, whether it is with you or in their hometown gym.

No, we may not be overestimating our importance. Obviously if the kids play, they will improve. There are different levels of improvement. The question posed is whether or not we work on skill development, or are simply an exposure program. I answered. I also backed up my answers with factual information.

[b]I've had a bunch of all staters, college basektball players, players of the year etc and not one has played aau.

What is a bunch? Where? Over how long of a period?

You pick the best kids from the area and then take credit when they improve. Really!

I do not simply pick the best kids in the area. For the most part, they are the best in the area now. How are you the best in the area when you are on the B team in 7th and 8th grade and the second highest freshman team at your high school? How are you the best in the area when you are not in the top 5 in rebounding or scoring in your own class in your own district?

I have a girl that averaged 8 ppg last year and now she is averaging 20. She has never played AAU, but she matured and worked on her game.

This would be an incredibly rare thing to happen in Class A boys basketball, especially in the WDA. Good for her to have the desire to work on her skills.

If you play a bunch and work on skill development you will improve.

I would think that this is obvious, and what I had just stated. We do workouts, twice a day, everyday when we do not have games. What would this be other than playing a bunch and working on skill development?

[rock83]

Oh my bad, so it isnt just you and aau that can make kids players. Your right its not rocket science when you start with the best kids in the area already.

[b]We might be overestimating our importance! If the kids play they will improve, whether it is with you or in their hometown gym.{[b]quote]

No, we may not be overestimating our importance. Obviously if the kids play, they will improve. There are different levels of improvement. The question posed is whether or not we work on skill development, or are simply an exposure program. I answered. I also backed up my answers with factual information.

[b]I've had a bunch of all staters, college basektball players, players of the year etc and not one has played aau.[b]

What is a bunch? Where?

[b]You pick the best kids from the area and then take credit when they improve. Really![b]

I do not simply pick the best kids in the area. For the most part, they are the best in the area now. How are you the best in the area when you are on the B team in 7th and 8th grade and the second highest freshman team at your high school? How are you the best in the area when you are not in the top 5 in rebounding or scoring in your own class in your own district?

[b]I have a girl that averaged 8 ppg last year and now she is averaging 20. She has never played AAU, but she matured and worked on her game.[b]

This would be an incredibly rare thing to happen in Class A boys basketball, especially in the WDA. Good for her to have the desire to work on her skills.

[b]If you play a bunch and work on skill development you will improve.[b]

I would think that this is obvious, and what I had just stated. We do workouts, everyday when we do not have games. What would this be other than playing a bunch and working on skill development?

[balla45]

No one has said that AAU is the only way that players can improve.

How many of the kids on the team I coached last year were the best in the area before we started working with them? Please, enlighten me.

[rock83]

You dont think the high school coach, the parent and even the kid had something to do with it.

[balla45]

Literally 90% of how good a player will be is based on how much work that player puts in. Some of them were going to be players. Some of them were borderline. I'll use borderline to talk about kids who were not on the A1 teams at their middle schools in Bismarck.

Feeney was, is, and will be a dude in whatever sport he chooses to be. He also was not on the team that I coached last year.

The high school coaches that I deal with on a regular basis, for whatever reason, don't seem to complain to me very much. There are a few who I actually sit down and meet with to avoid scheduling conflicts where we have a tournament when they have a team camp.

I have not said that I have an issue with your players being extremely successful. Good job. What is your point?

Also, looking at where you are posting from, it seems incredibly likely that the best player that you had in your program last season definitely knows who I am, seeing as she added me on facebook several years ago.

[rock83]

If you get a high school coaching job you will realize how difficult it is to put a team together and develop talent year after year. It starts when they are little and doesnt stop until they graduate. It isnt about bringing the best kids together for some games in the summer. Its good that you are into basketball and coaching, but there is alot more to it than aau. I hope you have a great deal of success in your coaching career,

Literally 90% of how good a player will be is based on how much work that player puts in. Some of them were going to be players. Some of them were borderline. I'll use borderline to talk about kids who were not on the A1 teams at their middle schools in Bismarck.

Feeney was, is, and will be a dude in whatever sport he chooses to be. He also was not on the team that I coached last year.

The high school coaches that I deal with on a regular basis, for whatever reason, don't seem to complain to me very much. There are a few who I actually sit down and meet with to avoid scheduling conflicts where we have a tournament when they have a team camp.

I have not said that I have an issue with your players being extremely successful. Good job. What is your point?

Also, looking at where you are posting from, it seems incredibly likely that the best player that you had in your program last season definitely knows who I am, seeing as she added me on facebook several years ago.

[balla45]

I am incredibly well aware that there is more to the development of players than simply "bringing the best kids together for some games in the summer". Running a program at the high school level is a lot of work. I see the camps that these coaches put on during the summer. I see the team camps they go to. The weightlifting, all with a lot of regulation on how much time can be spent with the players during the summer and what can be worked on.

There is a lot more to basketball than AAU, however, AAU is a part of basketball and I take issue with those who denigrate what we do with little understanding of what we do.

I am not sure if people do realize that the teams we play are loaded, and like high school coaches, we also want to win games. We also have to develop talent. We also have to run good stuff. It's not like we throw the balls out and tell the kids to go play. We also have to keep our kids coming back, which is much more difficult than one might think. While we may have some of the better kids in the area, we are not competing against area teams. This may come as a surprise, but I take what we do very seriously, much like the high school coaches do with their high school teams.

Just as a small example on a group you may have some familiarity with. Feeney's 14u team last year, at full strength, was probably one of the five best 14u teams in ND, SD, MN, MT, IA, and WI. If our kids do not improve at a rate close to the rate the teams from those states improve, we will fall off quickly, as they have more players to draw from, more kids over 6'6", easier access to tournaments, more money from Nike and Adidas to give them better facilities, etc.

[rock83]

I dont question how seriously you take AAU or coaching and its good that you do. I also realize that you play stacked teams.

[balla45]

Again, do remember that the original post I responded to was that of a person who said that kids play AAU for gamesgamesgamesgamesgames. I will defend what we do. You would never hear me say that kids play high school basketball for gamesgamesgamesgamesgames.

Anyway, I've given my piece on what we do.