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Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Tue Mar 15, 2022 4:53 pmby WalkingStick
Senior Player of the Year - just that Senior Award
Mr. Basketball - Career Award
Brandt/Hurlburt are my top 2
Yankton is a close 3rd
Limke, Wagner, Friesz & Hendrickson are the 2nd tier (Friesz may have been in consideration with top 3 if he hadn't gotten hurt...bummer cause Flasher looked primed to be R5's representative)
Don't know much about Nelson from Ray.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Tue Mar 15, 2022 4:55 pmby The Schwab
maddog1971 wrote:Ok....
If you are starting a team from Scratch to win State this year.... who is the number one player you will draft?
Also is Senior athlete just about how they perform on the court?
Is he about how good of role model he is on and off the court?
Is it how good they are in the class room? GPA?
Is it how good of college he got into?
Is it how much press he gets?
Is it how many dunks he gets per game?
Joe Hurlburt
On court performance is a huge part of it.
Plays a part in it, I would say what type of person he is would factor into it.
Plays a part in it
Could be mentioned, I never consider it a determining factor
No
No
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Tue Mar 15, 2022 5:24 pmby packers21
The Schwab wrote:maddog1971 wrote:Ok....
If you are starting a team from Scratch to win State this year.... who is the number one player you will draft?
Also is Senior athlete just about how they perform on the court?
Is he about how good of role model he is on and off the court?
Is it how good they are in the class room? GPA?
Is it how good of college he got into?
Is it how much press he gets?
Is it how many dunks he gets per game?
Joe Hurlburt
On court performance is a huge part of it.
Plays a part in it, I would say what type of person he is would factor into it.
Plays a part in it
Could be mentioned, I never consider it a determining factor
No
No
Joe Hurlburt and its not even close IMO
Playing Career and Senior Season play a role
Yes
No
No
No
No
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Tue Mar 15, 2022 6:46 pmby balla45
ndlionsfan wrote:balla45 wrote:I think the best basketball player is the player who can most impact winning at the high level. I think that player is Joe Hurlburt. I can explain that in significant detail if anyone would like.
The way I look at SPOY and Mr. Bball is who was the best player who impacted winning this season with some respect to their entire high school career. I don't care what their potential is on the next level. In my opinion, Yankton or Brandt are SPOY this season. Hurlburt is also in consideration as Enderlin has been very successful over the course of this season and his career. However, not leading his team over the hump hurts him. Who's going to go on and have the most successful college career? Who knows, probably Joe but just going to the DI level doesn't guarantee that. I look at what Mason Walters is doing at UJ and that is pretty impressive and definitely successful. Who cares if it is at the NAIA level.
Take college basketball out of the equation completely.
What did Brandt or Yankton individually do this season that is more impressive than what Hurlburt did?
Hurlburt comfortably wins the statistical comparison. His team advanced slightly further than Brandt’s. Four Winds did make state. If Four Winds happens to play and lose to Kindred at state, did their team do anything more impressive than Enderlin, other than beat Enderlin in a close game, where I felt Hurlburt did outplay Yankton?
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Tue Mar 15, 2022 7:02 pmby The Schwab
balla45 wrote:ndlionsfan wrote:balla45 wrote:I think the best basketball player is the player who can most impact winning at the high level. I think that player is Joe Hurlburt. I can explain that in significant detail if anyone would like.
The way I look at SPOY and Mr. Bball is who was the best player who impacted winning this season with some respect to their entire high school career. I don't care what their potential is on the next level. In my opinion, Yankton or Brandt are SPOY this season. Hurlburt is also in consideration as Enderlin has been very successful over the course of this season and his career. However, not leading his team over the hump hurts him. Who's going to go on and have the most successful college career? Who knows, probably Joe but just going to the DI level doesn't guarantee that. I look at what Mason Walters is doing at UJ and that is pretty impressive and definitely successful. Who cares if it is at the NAIA level.
Take college basketball out of the equation completely.
What did Brandt or Yankton individually do this season that is more impressive than what Hurlburt did?
Hurlburt comfortably wins the statistical comparison. His team advanced slightly further than Brandt’s. Four Winds did make state. If Four Winds happens to play and lose to Kindred at state, did their team do anything more impressive than Enderlin, other than beat Enderlin in a close game, where I felt Hurlburt did outplay Yankton?
I'll play the counterpoint, even though I think Joe should win the award.
If you take Joe Hurlburt off of Enderlin, what do you feel their record is? 15-8? 14-9? That would be my guess. Make the semi's in region 1
If you take Yankton off of FWM what is their record? 23-1? 22-2? Still win region 4
If you take Trey Brandt off of Beulah I would venture to guess that their regular season record would have been 7-14 and they would have maybe made the quarterfinals in region 7.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Tue Mar 15, 2022 7:15 pmby balla45
I agree with this.
Same thing with Flasher and Friesz.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Tue Mar 15, 2022 7:19 pmby The Schwab
balla45 wrote:I agree with this.
Same thing with Flasher and Friesz.
Absolutely. I think if Friesz was able to stay healthy I think Flasher would represent region 5 at state. I also think you could make the same case for Wagner and Ellendale, although I didn't watch as many of their games this year as I would have liked to.
I think it's a 3 person race between Brandt, Hurlburt and Yankton. I would not be surprised if any of the 3 of the win it. I think with Enderlin not making state the gap closed a little bit in my mind. If I had to bet on the award I would say that Trey Brandt will win it.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 9:02 amby Sportsrube
Question for Ball45, or anyone else who knows the answer. How is the Gatorade Player of the Year chosen in ND? What is the criteria? Who makes the decision? We know coaches vote for the Senior Athlete of the Year (which in my mind makes it a more prestigious award than Mr. Basketball) and the media votes for Mr. Basketball but I know nothing about the Gatorade Player of the Year.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 9:17 amby balla45
High school coaches can nominate a player for GPOY and the Gatorade selection group.
The biggest difference between Gatorade and others is that all classes are eligible. They consider on court accomplishments, GPA, and character type things like volunteer work and what not.
A nominated player will typically have their own coach write why they deserve to win, along with others in the coaching community, whether that be another coach in their region or otherwise.
I once wrote a letter of recommendation for Aanen Moody.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:11 amby maddog1971
My take on it is all senior 1 Senior Athletes deserve the award. BUT IMO I will take the players that are not worried about their stats or awards but the kid who plays so he team will win the game.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:18 amby d_fense
Sportsrube wrote:Question for Ball45, or anyone else who knows the answer. How is the Gatorade Player of the Year chosen in ND? What is the criteria? Who makes the decision? We know coaches vote for the Senior Athlete of the Year (which in my mind makes it a more prestigious award than Mr. Basketball) and the media votes for Mr. Basketball but I know nothing about the Gatorade Player of the Year.
I would defiantly lean the other way. I think Mr. Basketball is a more prestigious award. To me senior player of the year would be like District Player of the Year compared to the Mr. Basketball, Region Player of the Year. Region player of the year is only for Class B, Class A has their own. Where Mr. Basketball is an award that there is only one of for the whole state. Who votes for it doesn't matter to me. Coaches are busy with their own teams and scouting who they will or may play. Most don't have time to spend learning about a kid 200 miles away that there is nearly no chance they will ever play against.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:19 amby classB4ever
maddog1971 wrote:My take on it is all Region 1 Senior Athletes deserve the award.
Assuming this is a typo?
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 10:46 amby The Schwab
I have seen all of the regional senior athlete of the year choices play numerous times whether in person or online with the exception of the young man from Ray, but I feel confident in lumping him in with the rest of the young men when I make this statement:
The athletes on this list care about winning and doing what is best for their teams, period. To say that they care more about stats and awards is yet another shot at an individual who is a high school student.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 11:01 amby balla45
maddog1971 wrote:My take on it is all Region 1 Senior Athletes deserve the award. BUT IMO I will take the players that are not worried about their stats or awards but the kid who plays so he team will win the game.
Lol what? All Region 1 Senior Athletes deserve to be the State Senior Athlete of the Year?
I would edit your post for clarity, but I am not able to tell what you were trying to articulate.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 11:04 amby balla45
d_fense wrote:Sportsrube wrote:Question for Ball45, or anyone else who knows the answer. How is the Gatorade Player of the Year chosen in ND? What is the criteria? Who makes the decision? We know coaches vote for the Senior Athlete of the Year (which in my mind makes it a more prestigious award than Mr. Basketball) and the media votes for Mr. Basketball but I know nothing about the Gatorade Player of the Year.
I would defiantly lean the other way. I think Mr. Basketball is a more prestigious award. To me senior player of the year would be like District Player of the Year compared to the Mr. Basketball, Region Player of the Year. Region player of the year is only for Class B, Class A has their own. Where Mr. Basketball is an award that there is only one of for the whole state. Who votes for it doesn't matter to me. Coaches are busy with their own teams and scouting who they will or may play. Most don't have time to spend learning about a kid 200 miles away that there is nearly no chance they will ever play against.
My challenge with Mr. Basketball, and most awards in general, is that plenty of people who have the ability to vote do not do their homework and actually watch games.
The individuals making All Region and getting Region Senior Athlete are the individuals who should. The coaches in that area see those players play a lot.
I would venture to say that few of the people with Mr. Basketball votes have watched 5 full games of all of the candidates.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 11:37 amby Sportsrube
balla45 wrote:High school coaches can nominate a player for GPOY and the Gatorade selection group.
The biggest difference between Gatorade and others is that all classes are eligible. They consider on court accomplishments, GPA, and character type things like volunteer work and what not.
A nominated player will typically have their own coach write why they deserve to win, along with others in the coaching community, whether that be another coach in their region or otherwise.
I once wrote a letter of recommendation for Aanen Moody.
Thanks for the info. Is there anyone from ND on the Gatorade election group?
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 11:40 amby Sportsrube
d_fense wrote:Sportsrube wrote:Question for Ball45, or anyone else who knows the answer. How is the Gatorade Player of the Year chosen in ND? What is the criteria? Who makes the decision? We know coaches vote for the Senior Athlete of the Year (which in my mind makes it a more prestigious award than Mr. Basketball) and the media votes for Mr. Basketball but I know nothing about the Gatorade Player of the Year.
I would defiantly lean the other way. I think Mr. Basketball is a more prestigious award. To me senior player of the year would be like District Player of the Year compared to the Mr. Basketball, Region Player of the Year. Region player of the year is only for Class B, Class A has their own. Where Mr. Basketball is an award that there is only one of for the whole state. Who votes for it doesn't matter to me. Coaches are busy with their own teams and scouting who they will or may play. Most don't have time to spend learning about a kid 200 miles away that there is nearly no chance they will ever play against.
Do you really think the media members actually watch or learn about the vast majority of the players in the state? I have very little confidence in the media knowing anything about very few players outside of their coverage area. I think the media is way more bias when voting than coaches are. Just my opinion.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 11:46 amby Bison-Vikes #1
Sportsrube wrote:
Do you really think the media members actually watch or learn about the vast majority of the players in the state? I have very little confidence in the media knowing anything about very few players outside of their coverage area. I think the media is way more bias when voting than coaches are. Just my opinion.
Can only speak for our area which is R4, but our local sportscasters, Mark Beighley and Jake Kulland certainly do their homework and know of all players across the state. Listening to their broadcasts and shows will tell you that. Without a doubt, sports broadcasters/writers will want to push their local talent much like a coach would want to push their players. Will leave it like this, good sports broadcasters/writers are like good coaches, they do their homework and know of all players they might see during the course of the year.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 11:52 amby Bison-Vikes #1
balla45 wrote:maddog1971 wrote:My take on it is all Region 1 Senior Athletes deserve the award. BUT IMO I will take the players that are not worried about their stats or awards but the kid who plays so he team will win the game.
Lol what? All Region 1 Senior Athletes deserve to be the State Senior Athlete of the Year?
I would edit your post for clarity, but I am not able to tell what you were trying to articulate.
Guessing he meant all Region Senior Athletes. If not, replace articulate with regurgitate.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 12:34 pmby balla45
Sportsrube wrote:balla45 wrote:High school coaches can nominate a player for GPOY and the Gatorade selection group.
The biggest difference between Gatorade and others is that all classes are eligible. They consider on court accomplishments, GPA, and character type things like volunteer work and what not.
A nominated player will typically have their own coach write why they deserve to win, along with others in the coaching community, whether that be another coach in their region or otherwise.
I once wrote a letter of recommendation for Aanen Moody.
Thanks for the info. Is there anyone from ND on the Gatorade election group?
I could not give you an accurate answer to this question with any real degree of certainty.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 12:48 pmby WalkingStick
Sportsrube wrote:d_fense wrote:Sportsrube wrote:Question for Ball45, or anyone else who knows the answer. How is the Gatorade Player of the Year chosen in ND? What is the criteria? Who makes the decision? We know coaches vote for the Senior Athlete of the Year (which in my mind makes it a more prestigious award than Mr. Basketball) and the media votes for Mr. Basketball but I know nothing about the Gatorade Player of the Year.
I would defiantly lean the other way. I think Mr. Basketball is a more prestigious award. To me senior player of the year would be like District Player of the Year compared to the Mr. Basketball, Region Player of the Year. Region player of the year is only for Class B, Class A has their own. Where Mr. Basketball is an award that there is only one of for the whole state. Who votes for it doesn't matter to me. Coaches are busy with their own teams and scouting who they will or may play. Most don't have time to spend learning about a kid 200 miles away that there is nearly no chance they will ever play against.
Do you really think the media members actually watch or learn about the vast majority of the players in the state? I have very little confidence in the media knowing anything about very few players outside of their coverage area. I think the media is way more bias when voting than coaches are. Just my opinion.
depends on the media member...there are a few in the NDAPSSA that know about the whole state or do their 'homework' on players/teams.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 1:06 pmby maddog1971
The Schwab wrote:I have seen all of the regional senior athlete of the year choices play numerous times whether in person or online with the exception of the young man from Ray, but I feel confident in lumping him in with the rest of the young men when I make this statement:
The athletes on this list care about winning and doing what is best for their teams, period. To say that they care more about stats and awards is yet another shot at an individual who is a high school student.
I am not taking a shot at one player. I am a fan of Joe's and will be watching all the Colorado games I can to see how he is doing. Just because I don't say he is the best player in the country does mean I don't like the kid. He is a Kid and he has made some mistakes. And they all get put out in the public when he does.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Wed Mar 16, 2022 1:37 pmby balla45
maddog1971 wrote:The Schwab wrote:I have seen all of the regional senior athlete of the year choices play numerous times whether in person or online with the exception of the young man from Ray, but I feel confident in lumping him in with the rest of the young men when I make this statement:
The athletes on this list care about winning and doing what is best for their teams, period. To say that they care more about stats and awards is yet another shot at an individual who is a high school student.
I am not taking a shot at one player. I am a fan of Joe's and will be watching all the Colorado games I can to see how he is doing. Just because I don't say he is the best player in the country does mean I don't like the kid. He is a Kid and he has made some mistakes. And they all get put out in the public when he does.
Please elaborate as to which mistakes that individual made that were put out in the public. Additionally, please mention which member(s) on this message board other than yourself posted about any of them.
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Mon Mar 21, 2022 8:34 amby hoophoophoop
Paul Olson should have definitely been Senior athlete of year in Region 1, not even close IMO, probably up for Mr. Basketball also!!
Re: Senior Athlete of the Year
Posted:
Mon Mar 21, 2022 9:05 amby maddog1971
hoophoophoop wrote:Paul Olson should have definitely been Senior athlete of year in Region 1, not even close IMO, probably up for Mr. Basketball also!!
Paul Olson never cared about stats his whole basketball career. He cared about wins not awards or college scholarships. He would put up 35 one game and 6 points with 10 boards and 8 assists. Whatever was need to win. His health also holds him back quite a bit but a fun player to watch. You could see it in the state tournament games. The more they hit him, you could see his energy level go down.