Just Curious!!

Class A Boys
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Just Curious!!

Postby ndsportsfan14 » Sat Feb 05, 2011 3:24 am

So I don't know allot about class A ball as in the players other then the top players in Class A, but I was in a discussion the other day with some former class A basketball players, and they were talking about how weak class B basketball is and saying that Teams like this years North Star, Oak Grove, Cavalier etc. And 2010 Carrington boys and years past class b champions team wouldn't even compete in Class A basketball I was just wondering if someone could fill me in cause I strongly disagree with what they said example
Valley City's team this year is worse then years before and are 4-4 last time I checked in Class A and how did they do in Class B ? Not comparing them to like BHS or Fargo teams just saying.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby T$$ » Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:58 pm

In my opinion an elite class b team would be good in class a. Probably a state tournament team. The issue is that weak class b teams would be destroyed in class a. Look at dix trinity and minot ryan as two examples howwever of very good class b programs that were struggling in class a..
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby InTheKnow » Mon Feb 07, 2011 12:39 am

We have a very solid comparison this year through East Grand Forks. Here is how it looks...

EGF over GF Central by 3
Red River over EGF by 3
Grafton over EGF by 3
EGF over North Border by 7 (tied with a minute left)

#1 North Star over Grafton by 30

Keep in mind that Grafton is not even receiving votes in the B poll right now and North Border is going to finish 5th in the district. I am not saying that all teams would be competitive but I would say the top 20 B teams in the state would very competitive with 3/4ths the Class A teams this year.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby scoobyx2 » Mon Feb 07, 2011 7:31 pm

ndsportsfan14 wrote:So I don't know allot about class A ball as in the players other then the top players in Class A, but I was in a discussion the other day with some former class A basketball players, and they were talking about how weak class B basketball is and saying that Teams like this years North Star, Oak Grove, Cavalier etc. And 2010 Carrington boys and years past class b champions team wouldn't even compete in Class A basketball I was just wondering if someone could fill me in cause I strongly disagree with what they said example
Valley City's team this year is worse then years before and are 4-4 last time I checked in Class A and how did they do in Class B ? Not comparing them to like BHS or Fargo teams just saying.

If we are just talking about Class B teams "competing" with Class A teams, then there will always be some B teams that will do well against some A teams. But reality is, you can't take the Bismarck and Fargo teams out of the equation. They make up 8 teams in Class A. You have to compete with those teams to really say are competing with Class A schools.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby T$$ » Wed Feb 09, 2011 12:36 am

You can't compare gf teams. I don't think a gf team would win the b, or even a class b region. It is actually tougher to win the b as you may get stuck in a tough region. In class a you have a 50/50 chance to get to state and at state anything can happen. However if you took the top 4 a vs top 4 b each year class a would win 75 percent. Mainly because of better coaching
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby OldSchool » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:12 pm

T$$ you have showed how little you know. It wouldn't even be close. The "B" schools would be run off the floor. The biggest factor being depth. You can't compare how teams have done against common opponents like has been done with Red River. I've coached at both levels and watch many games at both levels, and aside from a few teams over the years their is no comparison, and I am not being biased its fact you can't compare an "A" school to a "B" school the numbers are far to superior at the "A". Don't get me wrong a Valley City or Wahpeton could get nipped by a Carrington or Hazen, but not very often. Your not going to see a top "B" school compete in the "A" ever. Just not possible think logically.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby Indy5 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:21 am

T$$ wrote:You can't compare gf teams. I don't think a gf team would win the b, or even a class b region. It is actually tougher to win the b as you may get stuck in a tough region. In class a you have a 50/50 chance to get to state and at state anything can happen. However if you took the top 4 a vs top 4 b each year class a would win 75 percent. Mainly because of better coaching

I agree with a lot of things you say until the last line. They wouldn't win because of coaching, they'd win because of depth. Coaching wouldn't be an issue for the B teams.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby T$$ » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:22 am

Please read my post before you disrespect me. I stated A would win 75 percent which I think is quite good. In fact I agree with you but you must realize class b would win some games. Are you old enough to remember the St.Marys holiday tournament? The first round always matched up A and B teams. Linton frequently won and one of the best games I ever attended was #1 Carrington led by Jim Kleinsausser playing #1Mandan. I think Mandan won in OT but don't remember as it was many years ago. Carrington won state that year.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby Indy5 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:26 am

T$$ wrote:Please read my post before you disrespect me. I stated A would win 75 percent which I think is quite good. In fact I agree with you but you must realize class b would win some games. Are you old enough to remember the St.Marys holiday tournament? The first round always matched up A and B teams. Linton frequently won and one of the best games I ever attended was #1 Carrington led by Jim Kleinsausser playing #1Mandan. I think Mandan won in OT but don't remember as it was many years ago. Carrington won state that year.

I've never been to that tournament. I didn't disrespect you either. I just disagreed, as would most, because the reason that the class A teams would win 75% of the games would be because of depth. Coaching would be a mute point for both sides.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby T$$ » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:39 am

If you look at coaching resumes almost all of the good class a coaches made the jump from class b. Steve Miller and Jason Horner are both former Napoleon head coaches. I can't argue with your point of depth however… as it is the number one factor. Coaching is NOT a mute point. Bismarck went decades without a state title until miller. Same with mandan. Century will be the next to break the drought as they have a fantastic coach. Some of the great class b programs like Hillsboro, Mayville, and Linton are because of great coaches who devolope programs by starting in the grade schools.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby Indy5 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 4:00 pm

T$$ wrote:If you look at coaching resumes almost all of the good class a coaches made the jump from class b. Steve Miller and Jason Horner are both former Napoleon head coaches. I can't argue with your point of depth however… as it is the number one factor. Coaching is NOT a mute point. Bismarck went decades without a state title until miller. Same with mandan. Century will be the next to break the drought as they have a fantastic coach. Some of the great class b programs like Hillsboro, Mayville, and Linton are because of great coaches who devolope programs by starting in the grade schools.

Yes there are great coaches is class A, but there are great coaches in class B as well. The coaches you named do develop their teams well, but they're able to do that better when you have more kids to choose from. Enrollment is why depth is by far the biggest difference. Put any great class B coach in those class A schools like Bismarck, Century, Mandan, ect. and they would be able to develop talent like that as well.
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby anyballgame45 » Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:02 am

Your typical class B coach may coach his entire career and only have enough talent to challenge for a State title a few times. How would those guys do if they had the talant pool of the bigger class A schools year in and year out to work with?
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Re: Just Curious!!

Postby T$$ » Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:30 am

I agree with andyballgame and their are a lot of loyal class b coaches with not a lot to work with. However I feel like the good coaches make the jump to class a if the right opportuniy arises. You cannot under estimate coaching. Why has bhs won 6 state titles in the last 20 years and chs 0. The kids all come up throught the same developmental programs and feeder programs. There is another obvious reason that I won't comment on
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