Hansted

[UND Fan]

I have seen Nik and Joe play multiple times. I have played against Nik and Joe multiple times. Hanstad is the best player in the state, quite possibly the best player in the state's history. Do not get me wrong, Nik is a very good player, but you are comparing apples to oranges.

Roundem6 said numbers don't lie. Looking at the numbers, Savageau has a 6'4'' player shooting over 50% from the field and 40% from 3, while getting 15 a game. Joe leads his team in every shooting category. Assists are not telling here, as Joe does not have the ability to get assists due to his team not having a post player or any shooters. Making a great pass to a wide open player is all he can do, it is not his fault if they do not convert. This makes your entire approach with assists pointless.

North is vastly superior to Dickinson, Joe is very superior to Nik, as much as I don't like to say it. In Nik's career he has played with Jordan May and averaged 12 a game, two 6'6'' big man and averaged 18, 5, and 5, and this season he has four players over 6'3'' to get assists to. In Joe's career he played with many good guards as a freshman and averaged 13, 5, and 3, as a sophomore he played with 2 good shooters and averaged 27, 7, and 4, and as a junior he is playing with no one taller than him and no one who can shoot the ball, yet still averaging 23 and 7, while leading his team in every shooting category, going against a box and 1 every night.

I would venture to say that every coach in North Dakota and probably 99% of coaches across the country would agree that Joe is a better player than Nik. Again, Joe was an ESPN player to watch and has received multiple division one offers while also getting interest from schools that McDonald's All Americans go to.

balla - your thoughts address the comparison and you certainly talked about his being very talented one of the best the state has produced. But how good can he be at the next level? I would asume that he will need to develop many of the skills that he isn't forced to work on today due to the type of team he is on.

Will he be an outstanding player at UND or NDSU, a darn good player at a mid-level DI school or a significant contributor at a Kansas or another Top 25 team?

[balla45]

I think he will have it much easier in college than in high school, because teams won't be able to cheat that much on him. As a freshman in college he might end up being a 6'5'' pure shooter or pure scorer, depending on how high of a D1 he goes to.

At this point I do not want to comment too much on where I think he will go, but I think he will be successful at a pretty solid D1, and unless a lot of things change, it will not be UND or NDSU.

[UND Fan]

balla - I appreciate your insight. I agree - it certainly looks like his talent level will take him to a level beyond UND/NDSU caliber.

[roundem6]

To add to this discussion about stats.

Joe scores more and gets more rebounds.

Nik gets more assists and steals. Less than one block a game really means nothing either way.

The WDA has two players averaging over 2 steals per game, while the EDC has five players averaging over two steals per game. This makes it seem as if the EDC teams are more loose with the ball than the WDA teams, which obviously helps Nik's numbers.

My question. What does Nik do that makes you think he is better than Joe? Using much of your logic, I can argue that simply by the numbers, Schreiner is arguably the best player in the state.

I didnt feel the need to argue this point anymore with you but now you say that schreiner is best player using my logic. is this a joke? Schreiner has taken 100 more shots, shooting pct Savageau 50.2% Schreiner 38.9%, 3 pt 35.8% Sav 25.6% Luke, Assists is 89-88 Savageau, steals 51-43 Savageau, Turnovers goes to Schreiner by 16, blocks and rebounds Savageau, so YES using my logic I would also say Luke is better

[roundem6]

make me LOL for an hour straight again please.

[balla45]

An hour straight is a little much. I don't want to calculate percentages, but I would venture to guess that Luke scores a higher percent of his team's points, gets a higher percent of his team's assists, and shoots better from the line. Nik beats him in rebounds and blocks. I do not see the humor.

[baseball]

Nik also has more steals and blocks, two categories which cant be blamed on teammates

Because teammates pressuring the ball, forcing a player to try to do more hten he should never results in steals by an off ball defender. and i dont see how comparing blocks is relevant with perimeter oriented players.

[schmiddy101]

Joe definately has the talent to play at a higher level than und and ndsu...because you have to realize that college coaches recruit kids that fit their system....so if he fits a system like gonzaga's why wouldn't mark few recruit him....but he has some work to do to get his team to the big show next week

[roundem6]

Luke also takes 30% of his team's shots while Nik takes 24%. As for assists, I will do the math, Nik gets 42% of North's assists and Luke gets 30% of RR's assists. Free Throws: Luke 78-99 (78.3%) Nik 116-154 (75.3%). Not too much of a difference to me considering Nik has shot 55 more. How else is Luke better? please enlighten me.

[balla45]

I don't think Luke is better, I just said the argument can be made. I can argue that Kielpinski is better than Savageau, and I can argue that Eiken is better. Luke would be difficult to argue because his shooting percentages are so low.

[roundem6]

Nik also scores 28.5% of North's points.
Luke scores 28.1% of RR's points.
Wrong on every guess it looks like, except for free throws, you got that one!

[balla45]

Nik also scores 28.5% of North's points.
Luke scores 28.1% of RR's points.
Wrong on every guess it looks like, except for free throws, you got that one!

That is why these are called guesses. But seeing that Nik had 4 last night and Luke had 30, these numbers have probably changed in favor of my guess anyway. Not that this one really matters.

Who will win EDC Senior Athlete of the Year?

[roundem6]

To add to this discussion about stats.

Joe scores more and gets more rebounds.

Nik gets more assists and steals. Less than one block a game really means nothing either way.

The WDA has two players averaging over 2 steals per game, while the EDC has five players averaging over two steals per game. This makes it seem as if the EDC teams are more loose with the ball than the WDA teams, which obviously helps Nik's numbers.

My question. What does Nik do that makes you think he is better than Joe? Using much of your logic, I can argue that simply by the numbers, Schreiner is arguably the best player in the state.

You said best player in state, which would make him better than Nik.

[balla45]

"Arguably."

[roundem6]

Luke also took 30 shots last night. 30 points on 30 shots.

[roundem6]

Nik also scores 28.5% of North's points.
Luke scores 28.1% of RR's points.
Wrong on every guess it looks like, except for free throws, you got that one!

That is why these are called guesses. But seeing that Nik had 4 last night and Luke had 30, these numbers have probably changed in favor of my guess anyway. Not that this one really matters.

Who will win EDC Senior Athlete of the Year?

Depends. I forget who votes on it but if it is coaches, probably not Nik. Nik deserves it though.

[balla45]

11-23 for 30 points.

[Baller_2010]

But seeing that Nik had 4 last night and Luke had 30, these numbers have probably changed in favor of my guess anyway.

What's your spin to make that impressive? Was it on two shots roundem?

[roundem6]

Nope it was on 9. Stats dont lie, so if you want, I could give you the edc website and you can check out the stat leaders? This is not even an argument, just you guys hatin.

[roundem6]

How about when Luke had 12 against North and Nik had 25.

[balla45]

Stats do not lie. But, if you looked at the site now, and added last night, Luke now has 2 more points that Nik, which is pretty even, assists are almost exactly even, Nik gets more rebounds and steals, and shoots better from the field.

I do not hate on Savageau.

[balla45]

How about when Luke had 12 against North and Nik had 25.

According to people from the EDC that post on this site, North plays defense and Red River doesn't. If Luke and Nik change places, does the amount that they score change as well?

[digger]

Nope it was on 9. Stats dont lie, so if you want, I could give you the edc website and you can check out the stat leaders? This is not even an argument, just you guys hatin.

Actually sometimes stats can lie. I agree with you though, Savageau is the best player in the EDC and should get Senior Athlete of the Year.

[Baller_2010]

This is not even an argument, just you guys hatin.

And who here is claiming that Nik is garbage? No one. Everyone realizes that he is a great player. Just because almost everyone believes Hanstad is by the far the best player in the state does not mean they are trashing anyone else. No one is hating on Nik - don't put words into people's mouth.

[balla45]

Just using numbers and the colleges recruiting people and the colleges people are going to, the senior class looks like this to me:

1. Savageau/Kielpinski--Same college, comparable numbers, comparable team success, etc.
3. Schreiner/Eiken--Same levels of college, comparable numbers, comparable team success, etc.

Would you agree with this?