North Dakota Preps

@ Bismarck Event Center; Nov. 18, 19, & 20

Quarterfinals
Thursday November 18th
G1 - 3 #2 Linton-HMB def Des Lacs-Burlington 0 (25-13, 25-12, 25-12)
G2 - 3 Thompson def #3 Langdon-Edmore-Munich 0 (25-18, 25-22, 28-26)
G3 - 3 #1 Northern Cass def Garrison 0 (25-16, 25-9, 25-10)
G4 - 3 #4 Kenmare def Dickinson Trinity #5 2 (21-25, 25-21, 15-25, 25-23, 15-9)

Friday November 19th
G5 - 3 #3 Langdon-Edmore-Munich def Des Lacs-Burlington 0 (25-15, 25-19, 25-20)
G6 - 3 #5 Dickinson Trinity def Garrison 0 (25-16, 25-13, 25-22)
G7 - 3 #2 Linton-HMB def Thompson 0 (25-18, 25-21, 25-18)
G8 - 3 #1 Northern Cass def Kenmare #4 2 (25-20, 26-28, (25-18, 13-25, 15-11)

Saturday November 20th
G9 - 7th Place - 3 Garrison def Des Lacs-Burlington 1 (31-29, 19-25, 25-17, 25-16)
G10 - 5th Place - 3 #3 Langdon-Edmore-Munich def Dickinson Trinity #5 2 (25-17, 22-25, 15-25, 25-14, 15-10)
G11 - 3rd Place - 3 Thompson def Kenmare #4 0 (25-12, 25-20, 25-15)
G12 - State B Title Game - 3 #2 Linton-HMB def #1 Northern Cass 0 (25-12 25-22, 25-22)

State Champions - Linton-HMB Lions (37-1)
Runner Up - Northern Cass Jaguars (36-2)
3rd - Thompson Tommies (33-6)
4th - Kenmare Honkers (41-4)
5th - Langdon-Edmore-Munich Cardinals (35-5)
6th - Dickinson Trinity Titans (28-9)
7th - Garrison Troopers (17-5-4)
8th - Des Lacs-Burlington Lakers (27-14)

The records for some schools are not very accurate…NDHSAA website missing lots of results. Hope that didn’t play a role in the seeding.

Was told DLB is 28-11; I know Kenmare has more losses because of having DLB tourney results and those weren’t entered on NDHSAA website (school’s responsibility)

Each school was able to send in accurate stats, records and head to head wins for all 8 coaches to review prior to seeding.

whine wrote:Each school was able to send in accurate stats, records and head to head wins for all 8 coaches to review prior to seeding.

Good…a little shocked that Thompson was unseeded

Not shocked on the presentation and unprepared nature of naming the seeds…very typical

Based on what I've seen to the finish of this season, it's a new low on the credibility index for everyone from coaches to the league.

Ineptitude has morphed to corruption.

heimer wrote:Based on what I've seen to the finish of this season, it's a new low on the credibility index for everyone from coaches to the league.

Ineptitude has morphed to corruption.

Ahh Thompson didn’t get seeded ?

Yeah! I won't post records, unless the NDHSAA starts updating their site, which I don't see happening.

#2 Linton-HMB vs. Des Lacs-Burlington
#3 Langdon/Edmore/Munich vs. Thompson
#1 Northern Cass vs. Garrison
#4 Kenmare vs. #5 Dickinson Trinity

Game Results vs. State Tournament Teams - I may be missing one or two because tournaments weren't reported well this year

Northern Cass def. Linton-HMB 3-2 (26-24, 8-25, 25-20, 15-25, 15-12) Regular Season
Northern Cass def. Langdon/Edmore/Munich 3-0 Regular Season

Linton-HMB def. Dickinson Trinity 2-0 (25-17, 25-16) @ DLB Tourney

Langdon/Edmore/Munich def. Thompson 3-1 (25-16, 21-25, 25-18, 25-19) Regular Season
Langdon/Edmore/Munich def. Des Lacs-Burlington 2-1 @ DLB Tourney
Langdon/Edmore/Munich def. Thompson 2-0 (25-21, 25-23) @ Langdon Tourney

Kenmare def. Dickinson Trinity 2-0 @ Coal Country Tourney
Kenmare def. Dickinson Trinity 2-1 @ DLB Tourney Silver Championship
Kenmare def. Des Lacs-Burlington 3-0 Regular Season
Kenmare def. Des Lacs-Burlington 2-1 (27-25, 15-25, 15-6) @ NWC Tourney

Thompson def. Linton-HMB 2-0 (25-23, 25-23) @ CC Tourney

Des Lacs-Burlington def. Kenmare 2-0 (25-14, 25-23) @ DLB Tourney
Des Lacs-Burlington def. Garrison 3-1 Regular Season

Linton/H-M-B defeated Northern Cass, 2-1, and Langdon Area/E-M, 2-0, in Northern Cass Tourney at beginning of the season. I believe that is the only loss for NC this year.
L/H-M-B went 14-0 in sets (7-0 in matches) while winning DLB Tourney, which included 9 of top 10 teams at the time.
L/H-M-B is 35-2, and I question every other State teams record on NDHSAA site, with the exception of Thompson and Dickinson Trinity.

heimer wrote:Based on what I've seen to the finish of this season, it's a new low on the credibility index for everyone from coaches to the league.

Ineptitude has morphed to corruption.

The four east regions should have four of the five seeds. Kenmare should be the other seed. The order is debatable.

The coaches vote, and they do not vote for their own team. "The league" does not weigh in.

You do have to make a choice between “inept” and “corrupt”. Are the coaches foolish, or are they carrying out a highly sophisticated plan? It’s one or the other (or neither). Can’t be both.

Nevertheless, there are two ways do this better.

1) Open ballot. Coaches must reveal their rankings. -Or,
2) Seed entirely by QRF and get rid of coach voting.

I would love to see the ballots be open. Coaches should have to defend their rankings. I know a lot of the coaches try and make sure certain teams end up in the opposite bracket as their team.

Wilbur wrote:Linton/H-M-B defeated Northern Cass, 2-1, and Langdon Area/E-M, 2-0, in Northern Cass Tourney at beginning of the season. I believe that is the only loss for NC this year.
L/H-M-B went 14-0 in sets (7-0 in matches) while winning DLB Tourney, which included 9 of top 10 teams at the time.
L/H-M-B is 35-2, and I question every other State teams record on NDHSAA site, with the exception of Thompson and Dickinson Trinity.

Tournaments need to be reported better but they aren’t easy to post on the NDHSAA site either. The system of reporting needs to improve

Sorenson23 wrote:Yeah! I won't post records, unless the NDHSAA starts updating their site, which I don't see happening.

Correct records
Northern Cass 34-1
Linton-HMB 34-2
Langdon 33-4
Kenmare 40-3
Trinity 27-7-2
Thompson 31-5
DLB 27-11
Garrison 16-3-4

WalkingStick wrote:

whine wrote:Each school was able to send in accurate stats, records and head to head wins for all 8 coaches to review prior to seeding.

Good…a little shocked that Thompson was unseeded

Not shocked on the presentation and unprepared nature of naming the seeds…very typical

Good Thing Thompson is well-coached and the unseeding meant nothing to them...still have to go out and earn the W (which they did!)

I like LHMB to win the whole thing.

WalkingStick wrote:Good Thing Thompson is well-coached and the unseeding meant nothing to them...still have to go out and earn the W (which they did!)

Such a BS Class B response.

Yeah, Thompson won. That still doesn't address that the seeding was grossly inept, that Langdon got hosed having to face the team ranked 5th in the state because they teams out west wanted one of their own in the semifinals, and that the coaches manipulated the process.

If you want to use the "gotta beat em all anyway" line while you dangle a stand of straw through your teeth, don't seed the tournament at all. Go back to random regional pairings. Better yet, throw all the east in one half and the west in the other.

If you choose to seed, you choose so as to specifically avoid the Thompson-Langdon matchup. Seeding the tournament has nothing to do with determining the champion.

This is why we can't have nice things.

By the way, are you suggesting that Thompson's opponent is not well coached? Because Langdon is extremely well coached, and is one of the top four teams there

Per usual the teams out west are not up to the speed of the east. I agree Thompson deserved a seed and maybe Langdon was seeded too high, they rely too heavily on Frieje, no one else contributed at all. The Linton/DLB match and the NO Cass/Garrison match were down right ugly. I'm taking Linton and No Cass in the finals with No Cass taking it.

I do agree that the seeding at the state tournament confused me a little bit. I could probably make the argument that Kenmare could have been the 3 seed at the tournament and Langdon/Thompson would have played in the 4 vs. 5 matchup anyway. It's very tough for me to make comparisons as I do not watch much volleyball throughout the year. I do 100% agree with you that Dickinson Trinity shouldn't have been seeded and Langdon should have been. I don't think there is much of an argument on the 1 and 2 seeds, but I think that Langdon, Thompson and Kenmare are the next 3 best teams in the tournament (I think you could make arguments for all of them to be the 3 seed.

I think this is another example of why we need something definitive to seed the tournament. Use a QRF formula, have an unbiased committee seed them (I'm not sure what this would be made up of? maybe make it the 3rd place finishers from the regional tournaments?). I do know that the answer is not secret ballots by the coaches in the tournament. I think if you are going to have a committee seed them, it needs to be an open discussion.

I personally would like to go to a power points system to seed all postseason competition like they use in SD to seed all of their tournaments.

I agree that seeding should be an open discussion. Wrestling is this way (or at least it use to be, have been away from it for a few years). Appoint a Region representative (anyone but the winner), it really wouldn't be that hard.
Further more, why can't we seed all 8? Is it because someone's feelings would get hurt?

sportsphenom wrote:I agree that seeding should be an open discussion. Wrestling is this way (or at least it use to be, have been away from it for a few years). Appoint a Region representative (anyone but the winner), it really wouldn't be that hard.
Further more, why can't we seed all 8? Is it because someone's feelings would get hurt?

Hurt feelings are exactly why they don't seed all 8. Whoever does the seeding - coaches, Region reps, media, etc..... the ballots/rankings from each one needs to be open to the public. Make them defend their rankings and also all them to rank their own team/region. I would bet a lot of money that some coaches try and rank teams so that a certain team is in the opposite bracket as their team.

heimer wrote:By the way, are you suggesting that Thompson's opponent is not well coached? Because Langdon is extremely well coached, and is one of the top four teams there

My point was Coach Strand had her team well prepared and wasn't concerned about a seed

You love to twist and jab other's comments to attack and fit your agenda.

I, do however, agree that something seems fishy on how the vote went down and it wasn't just one team that did it (because the highest & lowest ranking gets thrown out) and I was told the vote from 3 of the state teams and they had Thompson in the seedings.

Clarify that last statement? You heard from three coaches and they seeded Thompson?

heimer wrote:Clarify that last statement? You heard from three coaches and they seeded Thompson?

Yes...and they weren't all east coaches/teams

The Schwab wrote:I do agree that the seeding at the state tournament confused me a little bit. I could probably make the argument that Kenmare could have been the 3 seed at the tournament and Langdon/Thompson would have played in the 4 vs. 5 matchup anyway. It's very tough for me to make comparisons as I do not watch much volleyball throughout the year. I do 100% agree with you that Dickinson Trinity shouldn't have been seeded and Langdon should have been. I don't think there is much of an argument on the 1 and 2 seeds, but I think that Langdon, Thompson and Kenmare are the next 3 best teams in the tournament (I think you could make arguments for all of them to be the 3 seed.

I think this is another example of why we need something definitive to seed the tournament. Use a QRF formula, have an unbiased committee seed them (I'm not sure what this would be made up of? maybe make it the 3rd place finishers from the regional tournaments?). I do know that the answer is not secret ballots by the coaches in the tournament. I think if you are going to have a committee seed them, it needs to be an open discussion.

I personally would like to go to a power points system to seed all postseason competition like they use in SD to seed all of their tournaments.

I don't mind SD's system but I would want to tinker with it a bit so it's not like taking another state's ranking system...like we have with MN.