Best Coaches

[G]

well maybe he knows how to coach but he doesnt know how to act and im sure there is some other people out there that would agree with me

[pakkyzoo]

well maybe he knows how to coach but he doesnt know how to act and im sure there is some other people out there that would agree with me

Isn't this form about coaching?? The results don't lie.....

[justbrowsing]

Isn't some of coaching about the way you act?  I'm quite certain that in ND 9 man football it isn't 100% about winning.  There are very few (if any) 9 man schools in this state that would fire a coach because he isn't winning games if he's teaching his players how to do things the "right" way.  I've seen many many sidelines where coaches are composed and controlled throughout games.  Those are the coaches who produces kids that go out in public and people think "what nice kids those are."  I think there are some fantastic coaches in this state that have terrible career records. 

[Hinsa]

Isn't some of coaching about the way you act?  I'm quite certain that in ND 9 man football it isn't 100% about winning.  There are very few (if any) 9 man schools in this state that would fire a coach because he isn't winning games if he's teaching his players how to do things the "right" way.  I've seen many many sidelines where coaches are composed and controlled throughout games.  Those are the coaches who produces kids that go out in public and people think "what nice kids those are."  I think there are some fantastic coaches in this state that have terrible career records. 

Coaching is supposed to be about character building. Too often external pressures turn it into "just win!"

A coach should be concerned with preparing boys and girls to be good citizens and role models for others. Teach them how to set goals and work to achieve those goals. Teach them how to work together with others to achieve common goals. All those skills they are going to need when they hit the workforce.

Winning is just an outcome of achieving those individual and team goals. True COACHES get this.

[GRIDIRON GURU]

Those last two replys are the most panzy posts I have ever read and I have to check my manhood after reading them.

 

 

[Run With It]

wow. i do not agree with people saying magner is a bad coach at all! Yah he has emotion, but i can tell you i have seen WAY worse. And in my opinion, his emotions seem to get his team (in any sport you watch him coach in) more into the game. Sports around here aren't worth anything unless you have emotion, and he shows it. He might yell at you or reffs or what ever, but he gets his point threw. I know he is one of the most inspirational coaches you will meet. He talks alot about pride and playing harder and better for your own good, which is what sports should be about. And who ever says that coaches that yell and what not aren't "preparing" athletes to be good people in the world...then you must be mistaken. I know some of the dp athletes and i can name a few who are very good people and are "ready" for what gets handed to them, and you can't tell me magner wasn't one of the sources for this.
Alot of coaches are way worse out there. Yeah maybe Magner is very into the game, but it must be working or he wouldnt have the respect from the athletes in any sport he coaches, or such a great football team, because it sounds like to me he has turned that dp football team around in the past year.

[pakkyzoo]

wow. i do not agree with people saying magner is a bad coach at all! Yah he has emotion, but i can tell you i have seen WAY worse. And in my opinion, his emotions seem to get his team (in any sport you watch him coach in) more into the game. Sports around here aren't worth anything unless you have emotion, and he shows it. He might yell at you or reffs or what ever, but he gets his point threw. I know he is one of the most inspirational coaches you will meet. He talks alot about pride and playing harder and better for your own good, which is what sports should be about. And who ever says that coaches that yell and what not aren't "preparing" athletes to be good people in the world...then you must be mistaken. I know some of the dp athletes and i can name a few who are very good people and are "ready" for what gets handed to them, and you can't tell me magner wasn't one of the sources for this.
Alot of coaches are way worse out there. Yeah maybe Magner is very into the game, but it must be working or he wouldnt have the respect from the athletes in any sport he coaches, or such a great football team, because it sounds like to me he has turned that dp football team around in the past year.

Thank you....

[G]

wow. i do not agree with people saying magner is a bad coach at all! Yah he has emotion, but i can tell you i have seen WAY worse. And in my opinion, his emotions seem to get his team (in any sport you watch him coach in) more into the game. Sports around here aren't worth anything unless you have emotion, and he shows it. He might yell at you or reffs or what ever, but he gets his point threw. I know he is one of the most inspirational coaches you will meet. He talks alot about pride and playing harder and better for your own good, which is what sports should be about. And who ever says that coaches that yell and what not aren't "preparing" athletes to be good people in the world...then you must be mistaken. I know some of the dp athletes and i can name a few who are very good people and are "ready" for what gets handed to them, and you can't tell me magner wasn't one of the sources for this.
Alot of coaches are way worse out there. Yeah maybe Magner is very into the game, but it must be working or he wouldnt have the respect from the athletes in any sport he coaches, or such a great football team, because it sounds like to me he has turned that dp football team around in the past year.

Thank you....

any coach that gets handed athletes like magners had for the past 3-4 years could win so its not like hes doing anything special...and i didnt want to call him down i was just saying that the way he handles some situations just isnt right

[pakkyzoo]

wow. i do not agree with people saying magner is a bad coach at all! Yah he has emotion, but i can tell you i have seen WAY worse. And in my opinion, his emotions seem to get his team (in any sport you watch him coach in) more into the game. Sports around here aren't worth anything unless you have emotion, and he shows it. He might yell at you or reffs or what ever, but he gets his point threw. I know he is one of the most inspirational coaches you will meet. He talks alot about pride and playing harder and better for your own good, which is what sports should be about. And who ever says that coaches that yell and what not aren't "preparing" athletes to be good people in the world...then you must be mistaken. I know some of the dp athletes and i can name a few who are very good people and are "ready" for what gets handed to them, and you can't tell me magner wasn't one of the sources for this.
Alot of coaches are way worse out there. Yeah maybe Magner is very into the game, but it must be working or he wouldnt have the respect from the athletes in any sport he coaches, or such a great football team, because it sounds like to me he has turned that dp football team around in the past year.

Thank you....

any coach that gets handed athletes like magners had for the past 3-4 years could win so its not like hes doing anything special...and i didnt want to call him down i was just saying that the way he handles some situations just isnt right

Ok is that the same for Carpenter or any coach that has had successful seasons lately??

The thing that makes him such a good coach is the time he puts into his job.  Weight programs in the offseson is a prime example.  Not only did he take a team that was in the dumps 5 years ago, but created football to be a tradition in the communites of Dakota Prairie.  Nobody cared about football 5 years ago, now its what everybody talks about.  He has created a high school football program in 5 years.  The younger kids know what he expects out of him when they get older.  They look forward to it. Its all a cycle that he created with hard work and a great mind. 

[Brett Favre]

How much of the credit it can you give to the coach in the fact of building a winning a program?  I was a senior, and playing against Dakota Prairie when they were in the first year of their move to 9 man.  They had a ton of seniors in that group, and they had been working their entire careers to get a good team.  The one name I can think of, and he was a monster, is Brent Messner.  I really think that its a group of seniors realizing a goal, and wanting to have a great season that starts a program in this direction.  Had it not been for a senior class like that, getting the excitement for football in DP going.  You may not have seen this program develop the way it has....   I think you can say this about many programs in the state.  But definetely in this case you have to give more credit to the past players, and take some away from the coach.

[Hinsa]

Those last two replys are the most panzy a$$ed posts I have ever read and I have to check my manhood after reading them.

 

 

That's provided you have any manhood to check.....

Teaching kids values and how to set and achieve goals is panzy-a$$ed? I want to win as bad as anyone, but there is more to sport than just winning a freakin' game.

What kind of neanderthal would you like as a coach?

[Ocho Siete]

I personally would like a coach that doesn't teach whatsoever.  In fact, I'd like my coach to only care about winning a football game that for every loss, he executes one of the captains, in front of the whole team.  I would also prefer he beat the kids senseless for every miscue in practice, just to maintain perfection in a High School football game.

That's my coach...cuz heck, learning the character of a man is the least manly thing I could ever dream of.

[north_border_eagles2106]

How much of the credit it can you give to the coach in the fact of building a winning a program?  I was a senior, and playing against Dakota Prairie when they were in the first year of their move to 9 man.  They had a ton of seniors in that group, and they had been working their entire careers to get a good team.  The one name I can think of, and he was a monster, is Brent Messner.  I really think that its a group of seniors realizing a goal, and wanting to have a great season that starts a program in this direction.  Had it not been for a senior class like that, getting the excitement for football in DP going.  You may not have seen this program develop the way it has....   I think you can say this about many programs in the state.  But definetely in this case you have to give more credit to the past players, and take some away from the coach.

BRENT MESSNER WAS A MAN AMONG CHILDREN THAT YEAR

[GRIDIRON GURU]

That's provided you have any manhood to check.....

Teaching kids values and how to set and achieve goals is panzy-a$$ed? I want to win as bad as anyone, but there is more to sport than just winning a freakin' game.

What kind of neanderthal would you like as a coach?

That's the kind of reply I would expect from a weasel dude like you.

You must not have ever played for a winning team.

You must not have ever played at the next level.

You must not heve ever coached the game.

Because if you did you would know that the most important thing a coach can teach you is to kick the man's butt that lines up across from you.

That is what football is all about.

not some BS feel good make a better citizen crap like you are talking about, thats the parents job, The coaches job is to get the Johnny's and Joe's to be the best players that they can possibly be to win the individual battles which in turn will help you win the game.

If you are not in it to win you might as well stay home and play with your dolls.

 

 

 

 

[Mogvet]

Sorry learning character should come from the home, too much these days parents are too lazy to teach or show their kids how to act or how to grow up to be an adult and want the teachers to do it....then when the kids turn out bad they blame the schools instead of themselves.  I want a coach that gets into the game and wants to win...that is why he is there to win not bring up kids that is a parents job.  The coach is suppose to be part tactician part blood lust warrior.  He is the commander and I am the private he tells me to do something I do it no questions asked, he tells me I screwed up I better myself and make sure it doesn't happen again. 

This touchy feely society that we have now is enough to drive me nuts.  Does anyone else find it just a little bit odd that the lower placed trophies are as big as the first place trophies because we don't want the team that lost to feel like losers?  That it doesn't matter if you win or lose it's how you play the game that matters?

 

Guess what you lost, you were not as good as the other team...they were better than you.  Get mad, get in the gym, practice in the off season and come back and try again next year!

You want to talk about character building, try that philosophy in the outside world of it's how you play the game that matters...guess what you don't bust your a$$ you will not get a promotion, you will not get an outstanding evaluation you will be just like everyone else and never move up.   Same goes in sports if you don't bring your A game ever time if you don't put all you can into it during off times guess what.....YOU WILL NOT BE AS GOOD AS THE ONES THAT DO!!!!!! 

My coaches back when I played used to yell at me when I did something stupid or just plain bone headed on the field/diamond/rink and it used to pi$$ me off to the point of fixing it so I never did it again.  The whole point is to make the person want to change or modify that pattern/behavior, not "Oh that's ok, don't worry about it as long as you are having fun that's all that matters!" BS!  Do you think you are having fun losing game after game, year after year?  It feels good to go out and win, to play those games were you leave every last ounce of energy and emotion out on the field not this oh it's ok if I don't want to play today my coach/parents said as long as I am having fun and I never make mistakes according to them. 

 

/soap box off

[GRIDIRON GURU]

ATTA BOY MOGVET!

Political correctness and coddling has no place in football.

thanks for backing me up.

 

 

[justbrowsing]

I think you're exactly right if you're talking about schools that hire a football coach who's there to coach football, but that's not what gets you hired in the world of ND 9 man.  There are two kinds of head coaches in 9 man: the one who was hired as a science/history/whatever teacher and coaches football, and the one who works in the community and coaches the team because no one on staff wanted it.  Small towns can't afford to pick and choose their coaches based on finding someone who is "part tactician part blood lust warrior".  And anyone who thinks a small town should choose based on that is either ignorant or naive.

Small town football is a whole different social circle than big city or college football, but I don't think your argument is allowing for any middle ground.  You're suggesting that character coaches don't care if they win and that coaches who really want to win don't care about character.  The best coaches will do everything they can to win a game, but they will do it with tact, composure, and meaning.  I use Mike Berg from Grand Forks Central as an example.  That man is quite possible the greatest character coach in the state for the past twenty years, but that didn't mean he wasn't obsessed with winning.

Nobody here ever suggested that the coach should teach character instead of the parents, but as a parent, I certainly expect my kids' coaches to reinforce what
I have already taught my kids, and the only thing that you two have proved by your rants, is that we, as parents, still have to be careful about who's "teaching" our kids.

[Hinsa]

I think you're exactly right if you're talking about schools that hire a football coach who's there to coach football, but that's not what gets you hired in the world of ND 9 man.  There are two kinds of head coaches in 9 man: the one who was hired as a science/history/whatever teacher and coaches football, and the one who works in the community and coaches the team because no one on staff wanted it.  Small towns can't afford to pick and choose their coaches based on finding someone who is "part tactician part blood lust warrior".  And anyone who thinks a small town should choose based on that is either ignorant or naive.

Small town football is a whole different social circle than big city or college football, but I don't think your argument is allowing for any middle ground.  You're suggesting that character coaches don't care if they win and that coaches who really want to win don't care about character.  The best coaches will do everything they can to win a game, but they will do it with tact, composure, and meaning.  I use Mike Berg from Grand Forks Central as an example.  That man is quite possible the greatest character coach in the state for the past twenty years, but that didn't mean he wasn't obsessed with winning.

Nobody here ever suggested that the coach should teach character instead of the parents, but as a parent, I certainly expect my kids' coaches to reinforce what
I have already taught my kids, and the only thing that you two have proved by your rants, is that we, as parents, still have to be careful about who's "teaching" our kids.

I completely agree with what you're saying, JustBrowsing. You can coach to win and coach to build character at the same time.

I never once said building character is about coddling. I never once said I don't want to win. I'll play you in Monopoly and try to kick your you know what!

Gridiron Guru, read Tony Dungy's book called "Quiet Strength." Then tell me you have to be a "bloodlust warrior" to win. Dungy won the Super Bowl with dignity and with class. He is as competitive a man as there is on this earth, but he keeps that competitiveness balanced with morals and values that we should all aspire to. That's what I am saying that REAL COACHES get.

I am not advocating Political Correctness - I hate PC.

I am not advocating coddling - that's part of the problem with our world today.

I AM advocating teaching kids good values, and that parents, coaches, teachers, and any mentors to children should ALL be a part of the process. MOST IMPORTANTLY PARENTS.

By the way, Gridiron Guru, I played on 2 state championship teams. I played on a college team that was ranked 4th in the nation. I coached a state championship team.

Not bragging, just answering your.....well....how do I put it....."statements."

I made plenty of mistakes while I was coaching, but I learned from those mistakes and tried to get better at coaching to win while also mentoring young people.

I think I know what I'm talking about.....

[Ocho Siete]

That's provided you have any manhood to check.....

Teaching kids values and how to set and achieve goals is panzy-a$$ed? I want to win as bad as anyone, but there is more to sport than just winning a freakin' game.

What kind of neanderthal would you like as a coach?

That's the kind of reply I would expect from a weasel moron like you.

You must not have ever played for a winning team.

You must not have ever played at the next level.

You must not heve ever coached the game.

Because if you did you would know that the most important thing a coach can teach you is to kick the man's butt that lines up across from you.

That is what football is all about.

not some BS feel good make a better citizen crap like you are talking about, thats the parents job, The coaches job is to get the Johnny's and Joe's to be the best players that they can possibly be to win the individual battles which in turn will help you win the game.

If you are not in it to win you might as well stay home and play with your dolls.

You really struggle at understanding what people are saying.  Of course the players are in it to win it, that's why they sign up for the team.  That doesn't mean they won't learn a thing or two about being a man while they're on the team.  Unless you're completely new to the concept of football TEAM (I will assume you are), then you would know the whole TEAM aspect will build your character, whether you want it or not.  Watch any sports movie, watch any football championship tribute video, and they feed you the same thing: Building a bond between fellow man, and learning character, even in the pro level they learn character.

Coaches teach TEAM, and TEAM build CHARACTER, whether you like it or not.  The best coaches are the coaches that understand how to best utilize their TEAM, and thus...I'll let you figure out the rest.

[GRIDIRON GURU]

It's hard to know where a guy is comming from sitting behind a computer screen

you were comming off as a dude

I was probably comming off as a dink

we can meet in the middle

I would have pegged you as a 19 year old comming off a two win season last year who's coach hurt your feelings.

I was waay off. sorry.

You probably pegged me as a vain popping, animated, hat thowing, grass kicking, poor sport, arrogant, beer belly, dink who does not talk to his team for two days after a loss.

you were right on....

I too won a confrence title in high school

played in the national playoffs in college

I have coached at different schools and different levels had an undefeated season, and never once have I been part of a team with a losing record.

kids love to win. it teaches them life lessons on evey down they play.

 

 

 

[pakkyzoo]

That's provided you have any manhood to check.....

Teaching kids values and how to set and achieve goals is panzy-a$$ed? I want to win as bad as anyone, but there is more to sport than just winning a freakin' game.

What kind of neanderthal would you like as a coach?

That's the kind of reply I would expect from a weasel moron like you.

You must not have ever played for a winning team.

You must not have ever played at the next level.

You must not heve ever coached the game.

Because if you did you would know that the most important thing a coach can teach you is to kick the man's butt that lines up across from you.

That is what football is all about.

not some BS feel good make a better citizen crap like you are talking about, thats the parents job, The coaches job is to get the Johnny's and Joe's to be the best players that they can possibly be to win the individual battles which in turn will help you win the game.

If you are not in it to win you might as well stay home and play with your dolls.

You really struggle at understanding what people are saying.  Of course the players are in it to win it, that's why they sign up for the team.  That doesn't mean they won't learn a thing or two about being a man while they're on the team.  Unless you're completely new to the concept of football TEAM (I will assume you are), then you would know the whole TEAM aspect will build your character, whether you want it or not.  Watch any sports movie, watch any football championship tribute video, and they feed you the same thing: Building a bond between fellow man, and learning character, even in the pro level they learn character.

Coaches teach TEAM, and TEAM build CHARACTER, whether you like it or not.  The best coaches are the coaches that understand how to best utilize their TEAM, and thus...I'll let you figure out the rest.

This is really a pointless argument.  It started out with people arguing or sticking up for Magner, the Dakota Prairie football coach.  I was one along with GRIDIRON GURU who was sticking up for him.  All of sudden this argument has broke loose.   Well I am going to stick up for Magner by the points that "Ocho Siete" just made.  He has definately built a TEAM with character.  But what really makes Magner a good coach is what he just said, the best coaches figure out best how to untilize their team.

His first year he had a big group of lineman, including yes, Brent Messener.  He had a stud tailback in T.J. Severson.  They ran the wing t offense and pounded the ball 40 to 50 times a game.  The next year he lost the big bulldozing lineman and the tailback and went to more of an offense based on sweeps and traps.  His lineman were more athletic and runningbacks were smaller and quicker.  The next year he only had 3 returning starters and the team was predicted to finish 4 out 5 teams.  He semi-spread it out and used a ton of misdirection.  All three of this years, his offense was based on of some form of the "wing t" or "double wing" offenses.  These last two years he went to the spread offense.  Every year he has changed his offense in order for the team to be successful. 

In my opionion of a great coach is won that sets the goals for the season and finds the best way to acheive them.  Yes EVERYONE wants to win, and if you dont, more then likely your not successful.   Building character and team unity important for the players.  They gain that through practice, off the field, and during the game when they are in a difficult situation.  The coaches main job is to put and prepare their team to do the best they can in every situation.  Whether their team isnt as talented as others, fast as others, or as strong as others.  The coach no matter what should put his players in the right position to suceed. 

[Hinsa]

Whew! Now that we got the emotions out of the way, we're starting to make sense.

Gridiron Guru, nice post. That took courage. Thank you. And we can meet in the middle. I know football is a blood and guts, spit nails game - you have to have that mentality to be good at it. At the same time you can learn a lot about life skills in a team environment. That's all I was getting at.

Pakkyzoo, you make some very good points in your last post as well. Great examples of how Magner has adjusted his game planning to his talent.

Folks, I love sports. I love watching sports and talking sports. That's what this forum is all about. And the exchange of ideas and opinions on this forum is what keeps me coming back.

OK, I'll stop now before I get all mushy......

[Mogvet]

In no way, shape or form was I trying to belittle anyone on this board...only stating what I felt as a parent and a former coach.  Yes I think coaches should make sure the kids he is coaching not act like morons when at games and tournaments and such but I have seen time and time again parents acting like morons at games (getting into fights with other parents, cussing the refs out loud) and if their kid does it they dont' seem to mind what so ever.  I have seen a coach get beat on by a father because the coach didn't play his son for as much time as the parent though he should have been played. 

 

All I was trying to say is were do you draw the line with what a coach/teacher is suppose to teach your child and were do you as a parent step up and do the mentoring/teaching/molding?

 

Please understand I was not attacking anyone on this board but making my opinion heard...and if my opinion bothers you...don't read it.

 

That being said I think Coach Brown is a darn good coach from what people have been saying about him and from the teams he has coached in the past.

[vikes705]

I know its his last year this year but Randy Vigen from CV has to be mentioned. 

i completely agree!

vigen has been coaching CV for over 30 years, and last year he led the valiants to being the region 3 champs. i heard that the cv football field, which always has a reputation for being one of the best in the state, is being named after him

[Wild Wolves]

I will take Mike Schatz any day over any of these Johnny come lately guys.  Vigen has been at it a long time but how many titles does he have (1)?