Lack of Participation in High School Sports

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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby Indy5 » Fri Mar 26, 2010 10:26 pm

Depends what type of year your having. Good year, probably play the senior just to keep people happy and let the freshman go nuts next year as a sophmore. Bad year, play the freshman to build for next year. Maybe not necessarily start him but give me some major playing time.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby old#63 » Sat Mar 27, 2010 7:36 am

Again, and this is the last time I will say it, because obviously I am not convincing anyone. This topic is about participation. Every one of you that combat my point bring up winning teams that had success by bringing up young kids to play. I agree. You can build winning teams by doing that. And if you have a big enough school that you don't need mediocre kids to fill up the roster, fine. Schools that size usually don't have problems with participation. What I'm talking about is when your school gets down to 12 or 15 kids in a class. You need kids to go out. You need the slow kid. You need the fat kid. If you don't get them to go out, the school can't field a team (so then you coop). Those kids play ball because they want to be with their friends. Not to win championships.

And by the way, BB11, when Cavalier and Mayport sat upperclassmen to bring up 5 freshmen at once, all those freshmen still got to stay together as a unit and play ball together, didn't they? They got to play with their friends. Maybe that at least had a little bit to do with why they did well?

Participation!!! One man's opinion.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby BB11 » Sat Mar 27, 2010 4:12 pm

Old 63 - Yes I understand your point - and I agree with you to a certain extent. My point was that those two programs started younger kids and /or played younger kids and it didn't hurt their participation numbers obviously as they have thriving programs as far as numbers go and success.
I agree that to a certain extent if a coach plays a younger kid ahead of older kids, that this action might hurt participation a little - but not drastically, and probably for the better.
Let's be honest, if you have an older kid, or kids that are getting no time and younger kids that are - either one of two things are happening.
1. Your coach is an idiot
2. The younger kids are better - and the older kids aren't going to help your program. So if they quit, who cares?
I would think the the latter is a situation that is most likely to occur over the former. I understand that it hurts your numbers and participation, but if I was a coach, I wouldn't want seven seniors on my team when only 1 or 2 of them are ever going to play. That hinders the progress of your program - it doesn't enhance it, does it?
Maybe I'm old-fashioned, or just plain wrong - which I could be. But if I were coaching I would only want the 10, 15, or 20 guys that really want to be there, and really want to learn how to be a better BB player. I wouldn't want kids there that were there just to be there (if that makes sense).
I understand that playing younger kids might prohibit older kids from going out - and in that sense Old#63 - you are right - I guess my point with that is - why is that a bad thing? - if they won't help the team - why should they be there anyway? If they want to be on the team knowing they won't play much - I admire that - if they want to quit - I understand that - I just don't think playing your best players is a bad thing - regardless of age.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby Hinsa » Sat Mar 27, 2010 9:38 pm

BB11, the trouble is many schools are STARTING with 10, 15, or 20 kids before they move up any 9th or 8th graders. If 4-5 quit because they've been passed by, now you are down to 6, 11, or 16 kids.

Of course you can't run a program with 6 kids, so where do you go for players to fill out a practice and a JV? More 8th graders? Now you don't have enough junior high kids to have a practice.

Let's say you have 11 left. One is hurt, one is sick. Now you don't have a full practice. Move up some junior high kids for practice and now you're short for junior high practice.

Let's say you have 16 left. You planned on having a full JV and "C" squad schedule. A couple get hurt. Oops, there goes the C team unless you raid the junior high again.

Oh, and by the way, you haven't taken into account the effect on the rest of the junior high kids when a couple of their classmates are moved up. Several of them will not come out as freshmen because they didn't get moved up. So instead of graduating 2-3 seniors and moving in 6 freshmen, now you graduate 2-3 seniors and only move in 3 freshmen. And a few more of your upperclassmen see the handwriting on the wall with the 8th graders and quit before next year. Now instead of a net gain in players next year, you actually have a net loss in players.

And if you think this scenario is not real, I can give you a half dozen examples in my area alone.

My point is you better look at all the scenarios before you move up an 8th grader.

You used Cavalier and MPCG as examples of moving up young kids. In both cases, they had tons of kids out, had full C teams, and could afford to lose a few kids along the way. That is a luxury most B schools don't have anymore.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby Bisonguy06 » Sun Mar 28, 2010 1:04 pm

Very few cuts are made at class b schools. If kids aren't participating, that is ultimately their own choice.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby BB11 » Sun Mar 28, 2010 1:34 pm

Hinsa wrote:BB11, the trouble is many schools are STARTING with 10, 15, or 20 kids before they move up any 9th or 8th graders. If 4-5 quit because they've been passed by, now you are down to 6, 11, or 16 kids.

Of course you can't run a program with 6 kids, so where do you go for players to fill out a practice and a JV? More 8th graders? Now you don't have enough junior high kids to have a practice.

Let's say you have 11 left. One is hurt, one is sick. Now you don't have a full practice. Move up some junior high kids for practice and now you're short for junior high practice.

Let's say you have 16 left. You planned on having a full JV and "C" squad schedule. A couple get hurt. Oops, there goes the C team unless you raid the junior high again.

Oh, and by the way, you haven't taken into account the effect on the rest of the junior high kids when a couple of their classmates are moved up. Several of them will not come out as freshmen because they didn't get moved up. So instead of graduating 2-3 seniors and moving in 6 freshmen, now you graduate 2-3 seniors and only move in 3 freshmen. And a few more of your upperclassmen see the handwriting on the wall with the 8th graders and quit before next year. Now instead of a net gain in players next year, you actually have a net loss in players.

And if you think this scenario is not real, I can give you a half dozen examples in my area alone.

My point is you better look at all the scenarios before you move up an 8th grader.

You used Cavalier and MPCG as examples of moving up young kids. In both cases, they had tons of kids out, had full C teams, and could afford to lose a few kids along the way. That is a luxury most B schools don't have anymore.


I see your point as well - and I'm not doubting any of what you're saying. My point is - as a dedicated player, or as a coach, you want to be at your best. If you have 4 or 5 kids that are there just to be there, and quit as a result of younger kids moving up - your not losing anything. (in numbers yes - but not in ability or attitude).
I do agree with you - that it COULD damage your JH program - but just as you have a half dozen examples in your area where it was a bad thing - I could give you a half a dozen examples in my area - where a JH or Freshman kid was moved up and it benefitted the team - maybe not in participation - but the players that are being lost - are players that didn't care in the first place.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby BB11 » Sun Mar 28, 2010 1:37 pm

on a side note, I respect your opinions Old #63 and Hinsa, and know that you bring intelligent insight to an argument.
I think we agree in principle on the impacts of moving a young kid up - we just disagree with the level of importance that impact makes with the rest of the program.
Good subject - but I kind of got it off topic - so I will stop now.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby ndfan » Sun Nov 28, 2010 8:46 am

Prep sports: Fewer North Dakota kids are playing sports
Participation has declined 10 percent in less than a decade
By: Heath Hotzler , The Forum

FARGO — High school sports participation in North Dakota has declined 10 percent in less than a decade.

The state is one of only four that has endured losses since 2002-03, according to numbers provided by the National Federation of State High School Associations.

The stark numbers are all too familiar to North Dakota High School Activities Association Executive Secretary Sherm Sylling. It’s a trend that he and many administrators in the state have been monitoring for years.

According to Sylling, if the trend is not reversed or at least slowed down, there could be dire consequences.

“We need to start talking about keeping kids involved,” Sylling said. “We need to address the fact that if our kids don’t feel good enough and they quit, in the long term we are losing our broad base of support. That is a major cost.”

There are several theories about why high school sports participation is shrinking in North Dakota. The state trails only Vermont (minus-31) and Montana (minus-14) in percentage of student-athletes lost since 2002-03. The District of Columbia also dropped 18 percent of its sports participants.

A major culprit for North Dakota’s issues could be the state’s inability to hold its residents. North Dakota’s total high school enrollment has dropped nine percent since 2002-03, according to the Department of Public Instruction.

However, that’s only part of the problem.

Dedication wanes

West Fargo boys basketball coach Greg Limke, in his 10th season with the Packers, said children are making choices to quit sports at an earlier age than ever before. If players don’t feel they can be stars in their sport, they sometimes give up, Limke said.

In basketball, Limke said the travelling team atmosphere is partly to blame.

“I think there are guys out there who want to play,” he said. “But trying to attach them to a group is difficult. When they don’t have a team, it’s difficult to find gym time. … As coaches, we are all very concerned. What can we do to reverse the numbers? In every sport, why are kids choosing not to be involved?”

Fargo South girls basketball coach Craig Flaagan agrees that travelling teams can alienate some players. Cost is a major issue, Flaagan said.

“It might be the economics,” said Flaagan, entering his 19th season as the Bruins coach. “The cost to play on a travelling team and going to camps, the pressure of programs to do those kinds of things maybe have kept some kids away.”

Flaagan said that his program has not seen declining numbers the last several years.

But that hasn’t been the case for everyone.

In North Dakota, boys and girls basketball has taken the biggest hit over the last eight years. The sport has lost 1,235 total participants.

Football has seen a decline of 710 total participants, and boys golf has dropped 390.

North Dakota has lost a total of 2,833 high school sports participants the last eight years. Boys sports make up the bulk of the losses, having declined 1,966 student-athletes.

Linton-HMB football coach Dan Imdieke, who has coached football and wrestling for 35 years, said he’s seen a shift in priorities for many students.

“The old theory is that kids would rather work,” Imdieke said. “They don’t have that competitive drive. . . . For me, if they wanted to work to buy a car instead of go out for a sport I think I would buy them the car. Sports aren’t the most important thing, but they are right up there.”

Scott Olsen, who just finished his first year as head coach at Hillsboro, said many parents are not pushing their kids to get involved with sports. He said some kids would rather play video games than join a sports team.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby scoobyx2 » Sun Nov 28, 2010 7:06 pm

The politics in sports is getting a little crazy, and many parents just don't want to play the game. There have been posts talking about moving up 5 freshman at a school. I would guess that out of that 5, there were 1 or 2 who were better than the others (even tho maybe all of them were talented), but it probably would have cause too much drama to move just those kids. As for the traveling teams, they can be very harmful to a program. If any coach at a school runs a traveling team for his or her kid, and a kid doesn't get asked, then what are your chances?
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby shelly k » Sun Nov 28, 2010 10:52 pm

scoobyx2 wrote:The politics in sports is getting a little crazy, and many parents just don't want to play the game. There have been posts talking about moving up 5 freshman at a school. I would guess that out of that 5, there were 1 or 2 who were better than the others (even tho maybe all of them were talented), but it probably would have cause too much drama to move just those kids. As for the traveling teams, they can be very harmful to a program. If any coach at a school runs a traveling team for his or her kid, and a kid doesn't get asked, then what are your chances?


That's one reason coaches should not be allowed to coach their own kids in a school program. Another related note, supposedly CHS had trouble getting enough kids to fill 2 freshman girls B Ball teams, which I find odd given the number of kids feeding into the school.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby scoobyx2 » Sun Nov 28, 2010 11:34 pm

shelly k wrote:
scoobyx2 wrote:The politics in sports is getting a little crazy, and many parents just don't want to play the game. There have been posts talking about moving up 5 freshman at a school. I would guess that out of that 5, there were 1 or 2 who were better than the others (even tho maybe all of them were talented), but it probably would have cause too much drama to move just those kids. As for the traveling teams, they can be very harmful to a program. If any coach at a school runs a traveling team for his or her kid, and a kid doesn't get asked, then what are your chances?


That's one reason coaches should not be allowed to coach their own kids in a school program. Another related note, supposedly CHS had trouble getting enough kids to fill 2 freshman girls B Ball teams, which I find odd given the number of kids feeding into the school.

That is interesting especially since Bismarck is the biggest school district in ND. I wonder if Bismarck High is having similar issues.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby shelly k » Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:17 pm

yea it's weird, the CHS girls B Ball coach will call unlucky upper classman and tell them not to bother to try out as there is no place for them, then he has to turn around and call freshman to encourage them to try out. BHS must be doing ok with freshman girls b ball numbers as they moved up the traveling team girls to Soph/Jv and still have enough kids for 2 freshman teams.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby scoobyx2 » Tue Nov 30, 2010 7:48 am

shelly k wrote:yea it's weird, the CHS girls B Ball coach will call unlucky upper classman and tell them not to bother to try out as there is no place for them, then he has to turn around and call freshman to encourage them to try out. BHS must be doing ok with freshman girls b ball numbers as they moved up the traveling team girls to Soph/Jv and still have enough kids for 2 freshman teams.

The CHS coach is a good coach.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby heimer » Tue Nov 30, 2010 9:06 am

Just throwing this out there for debate:

Participation down since 2002-03. That was the first year girls basketball moved to the winter.

Could be just an interesting coincidence.

Personally, I single out two factors: the overcommitment to sportsmanship and, yes, I'll bring it up, the two-class system of basketball, which happens to be the sport that has taken the biggest hit.

First, competing and winning isn't as much fun when every celebratory thing you do as a team is looked down upon. We all know that there is a line, and sometimes kids, and fans, cross it. I think we've crossed the line the other way lately, making it wrong to enjoy winning.

Second, more and more co-ops are formed to compete, instead of to keep programs alive. I look at Finley-Sharon/Hope-Page. If not for the fact that they are in the same district as Oak Grove, Central Cass, Kindred, etc., both of those schools could likely field their own teams. When you take two teams and reduce them to one, you will naturally have a decline in participation.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby winner-within » Tue Nov 30, 2010 1:42 pm

I think its great kids are not being pushed to go out....You have to love the game and the sport....you can only play for Mom and Dad and Grandpa and grandma or the coach so long and its going to get old...its the technology craze that has cut into this participation also....take a smoker he/she leaves all places sooner than the rest... Why? so he/she can go smoke.

Allot of kids have put priority's on their technical devises and have found satisfaction in them that replaces sports, or the desire to play them...fact!! I agree, Co-op's to compete are also a culprit.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby luvmy3gbb1wr » Tue Nov 30, 2010 6:27 pm

There are many culprits......but there's one that my family has experienced. I have a college bb player that was told by her high school head coach at the time that she would never play varsity bb or college bb....yet oddly enough she starts and stars for her current college team in minnesota (she was recruited from playing AAU).....hmmm My son (in football) was essentially used as a practice dummy for four years. His senior year, the coach didn't get him a playbook for six weeks and would only let him learn and run certain plays. As a freshman/soph, he was told to wait his turn the older boys had put their time in and deserved to play. ok fine.......His junior year he agreed to be the jv quarterback so the jv would have games, he asked the coach to let him learn other positions too. didn't happen. He did the team thing, didn't complain worked hard, went to camps, lifted and got told his senior year that the younger boys needed to play so they would have experience when he left. He wasn't an all stater but he certainly wasn't that bad. He stuck it out but it got old, going to practice for 3-4 hours/day, in all types of weather, and the reward was to stand there. He was one of the last senior boys playing......reason, the others decided they could spend 3-4 hours a day working at a job instead. child number 3, excellent basketball and volleyball player, hard worker, hustler, went to camps, played AAU bb in MN(involved tryouts), jo vb (involved tryouts) yet she couldn't even get varsity time on a 3-18 team that her AAU team would have walloped. hmmm more of the same for child 4......both of these girls have had classmates quit playing sports not for video games but they don't want to practice and practice yet never play. I know that some kids don't want to be in sports and that's fine.....but it's not just video games that have moved kids out of participation; and it is not that every kid thinks they are a star (or every parent), Sometimes kids and parents are just tired of the crap that comes with a lot of teams.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby winner-within » Tue Nov 30, 2010 6:46 pm

luvmy3gbb1wr wrote:There are many culprits......but there's one that my family has experienced. I have a college bb player that was told by her high school head coach at the time that she would never play varsity bb or college bb....yet oddly enough she starts and stars for her current college team in minnesota (she was recruited from playing AAU).....hmmm My son (in football) was essentially used as a practice dummy for four years. His senior year, the coach didn't get him a playbook for six weeks and would only let him learn and run certain plays. As a freshman/soph, he was told to wait his turn the older boys had put their time in and deserved to play. ok fine.......His junior year he agreed to be the jv quarterback so the jv would have games, he asked the coach to let him learn other positions too. didn't happen. He did the team thing, didn't complain worked hard, went to camps, lifted and got told his senior year that the younger boys needed to play so they would have experience when he left. He wasn't an all stater but he certainly wasn't that bad. He stuck it out but it got old, going to practice for 3-4 hours/day, in all types of weather, and the reward was to stand there. He was one of the last senior boys playing......reason, the others decided they could spend 3-4 hours a day working at a job instead. child number 3, excellent basketball and volleyball player, hard worker, hustler, went to camps, played AAU bb in MN(involved tryouts), jo vb (involved tryouts) yet she couldn't even get varsity time on a 3-18 team that her AAU team would have walloped. hmmm more of the same for child 4......both of these girls have had classmates quit playing sports not for video games but they don't want to practice and practice yet never play. I know that some kids don't want to be in sports and that's fine.....but it's not just video games that have moved kids out of participation; and it is not that every kid thinks they are a star (or every parent), Sometimes kids and parents are just tired of the crap that comes with a lot of teams.



I hear ya clucking big chicken....and I can tell you one thing I'm just coming into this stage, hopefully our experience is a better one
Congrats on you daughter in College Ball that is a bitter yet sweet story...and thanks for pointing this out. there are Many folks who would agree it can be a waste of some valuable time in a kids life....Problem is, is they can go on to resent their own school.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby scoobyx2 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 7:45 am

luvmy3gbb1wr wrote:There are many culprits......but there's one that my family has experienced. I have a college bb player that was told by her high school head coach at the time that she would never play varsity bb or college bb....yet oddly enough she starts and stars for her current college team in minnesota (she was recruited from playing AAU).....hmmm My son (in football) was essentially used as a practice dummy for four years. His senior year, the coach didn't get him a playbook for six weeks and would only let him learn and run certain plays. As a freshman/soph, he was told to wait his turn the older boys had put their time in and deserved to play. ok fine.......His junior year he agreed to be the jv quarterback so the jv would have games, he asked the coach to let him learn other positions too. didn't happen. He did the team thing, didn't complain worked hard, went to camps, lifted and got told his senior year that the younger boys needed to play so they would have experience when he left. He wasn't an all stater but he certainly wasn't that bad. He stuck it out but it got old, going to practice for 3-4 hours/day, in all types of weather, and the reward was to stand there. He was one of the last senior boys playing......reason, the others decided they could spend 3-4 hours a day working at a job instead. child number 3, excellent basketball and volleyball player, hard worker, hustler, went to camps, played AAU bb in MN(involved tryouts), jo vb (involved tryouts) yet she couldn't even get varsity time on a 3-18 team that her AAU team would have walloped. hmmm more of the same for child 4......both of these girls have had classmates quit playing sports not for video games but they don't want to practice and practice yet never play. I know that some kids don't want to be in sports and that's fine.....but it's not just video games that have moved kids out of participation; and it is not that every kid thinks they are a star (or every parent), Sometimes kids and parents are just tired of the crap that comes with a lot of teams.

Thanks for posting this. When this happens to a hard working family, other families are going hear about it, and will steer their kids into other positive opportunities. It has nothing to do with the love of the game or tech games. We have kids in our neighborhood who are athletic and smart. They are always playing leagues for park and rec, and the y, but their parents support them in music and drama at school, while taking time to teach them skiing, snowboarding, and golf on their own, and both parents are very succssful business people. When I see them, I question our decisions in sports a lot.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby winner-within » Wed Dec 01, 2010 10:56 am

scoobyx2 wrote:
luvmy3gbb1wr wrote:There are many culprits......but there's one that my family has experienced. I have a college bb player that was told by her high school head coach at the time that she would never play varsity bb or college bb....yet oddly enough she starts and stars for her current college team in minnesota (she was recruited from playing AAU).....hmmm My son (in football) was essentially used as a practice dummy for four years. His senior year, the coach didn't get him a playbook for six weeks and would only let him learn and run certain plays. As a freshman/soph, he was told to wait his turn the older boys had put their time in and deserved to play. ok fine.......His junior year he agreed to be the jv quarterback so the jv would have games, he asked the coach to let him learn other positions too. didn't happen. He did the team thing, didn't complain worked hard, went to camps, lifted and got told his senior year that the younger boys needed to play so they would have experience when he left. He wasn't an all stater but he certainly wasn't that bad. He stuck it out but it got old, going to practice for 3-4 hours/day, in all types of weather, and the reward was to stand there. He was one of the last senior boys playing......reason, the others decided they could spend 3-4 hours a day working at a job instead. child number 3, excellent basketball and volleyball player, hard worker, hustler, went to camps, played AAU bb in MN(involved tryouts), jo vb (involved tryouts) yet she couldn't even get varsity time on a 3-18 team that her AAU team would have walloped. hmmm more of the same for child 4......both of these girls have had classmates quit playing sports not for video games but they don't want to practice and practice yet never play. I know that some kids don't want to be in sports and that's fine.....but it's not just video games that have moved kids out of participation; and it is not that every kid thinks they are a star (or every parent), Sometimes kids and parents are just tired of the crap that comes with a lot of teams.

Thanks for posting this. When this happens to a hard working family, other families are going hear about it, and will steer their kids into other positive opportunities. It has nothing to do with the love of the game or tech games. We have kids in our neighborhood who are athletic and smart. They are always playing leagues for park and rec, and the y, but their parents support them in music and drama at school, while taking time to teach them skiing, snowboarding, and golf on their own, and both parents are very succssful business people. When I see them, I question our decisions in sports a lot.


You can't say nothing...there are many culprits and these are 2
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby B-oldtimer » Wed Feb 08, 2012 4:38 pm

I as parent have seen this developing for long time and only think its going to get worse. What these kidsare put through to play sports its amazing we have participation we have. I think we need to get back to some old rules on participation;whenkids play the sports, and look at whole nd sports activities guidance and philosphy. When i was in school it was illegal to play on traveling teams, Open gyms were only if kids did it themselves for fun, and when the season ended it ended there was no weight lifting program, summer league, or camps. The kids that play now are expected to do all of this and if they play multiple sports this just multiplies their commitment. Instead of fun activitivy it become full time job. Now you add in the politcs and moving up younger players to develop a winner you can see why kids are quitting on sports.
Sports was orginally organized as fun activity that kids could play with there peers to teach them to work with others and see the benefits of working hard together.

The schools have gotten smaller on average but we have all programs sports, Music, and other organizations going on which makes it good for our kids to get exposed and be able to participate in all these activities. But what i see at small class B level coaches think they have priority and if player has
activiity in Music or something else it takes time away from sport for even one practice that player is
penalized. I will bet you if ask alot of parents this has happened to their child or someone else on one
of the teams. Lets face it that majority of kids never will play ball at much higher level and few that
recieve support from colleges is even less. But i willing to bet that their are way more being supported
for some other of activivities in college through scholarships and grants from the colleges.

The idea of coop was good but it has been used also to much as tool for schools to be competitive with other larger class B schools. Look at discussion website and you can see that very largested class B school are ones ompeting for regional and state titles. The smaller schools felt only way to compete was to coop.
I think it also what is finally going to kill golden goose the class B basketball state tournament. We already
are seeing declines in attendance, participation, and general interest in basketball in the state. When i grew up that was talk of town no matter what town you went to. Today people when they talk about it
are trying to figure out who the teams are. If your winning program there's still some interest but if your loosing there very little interest. When i was groing up even if were loosing town came and supported the
team and they wanted to see what the future team would look like for comming year. Now that interest is not there because of these large coops. I know some of these coops the kids are comming from such large
distance where kids playing on starting 5 live 50 miles apart.

Like i say we need to revauate how we as state and schools are going to run high school sports league. Just quick note here look at Fargo when Fargo South split up into Davies. Both Schools have very competive teams. Maybe they should look at these large schools having way more than one set of teams i willing to
bet they could produce many very good teams and would that help participation go up too.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby defensewinsgames » Sat Feb 18, 2012 11:19 am

^^^ I completly agree. I think that changing to a three class system would really help address a lot of the issues you talked about. In order to have really good programs now you almost have to be a one or 2 sport athlete. This puts bigger schools at huge advantages, little towns can't have one sport athletes or they wouldn't have teams. In most class b schools all athletes are at least 2 sport athletes and usually 3 sport. They QB, point guard, and track star are all the same person, plus they are probably in choir, FFA, national honor society, student council, band, or whatever else the school offers.

When a small town has 500 people and an average class size of 12, it is pretty hard to be competitive. These small towns on their own usually can't even get enough for a team. That is why they are all in a co op. When these co ops form it seems to make some of the kids who were on the edge of wanting to play or not before quit. We need to go up to a 3 class system to take some pressure off of these small schools. It is no fun knowing they are going into the season an losing by 20+ because 5 or 6 of the teams they play have 5 times the kids.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby Bisonguy06 » Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:12 pm

If what you are saying is true about small schools being unable to compete, please explain North Star's run. Please explain Berthold. Please explain Turtle Lake Mercer. Please explain Powers Lake and New England.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby defensewinsgames » Sat Feb 18, 2012 1:21 pm

I didn't mean it is impossible, what I meant is it's a lot harder. Yes there are always exceptions, it kind of amazes me how often people tend to think the select few represent the majority. For every team you just named there is 10 other more small schools who don't do well. Yes small schools get some classes of great athletes, but eventually those athletes graduate and it's much harder to rebuild the program when instead of 50 kids a class you have 12. That's all I'm saying, I'm from a small town that won a state championship so I know it's possible, no need to get all angry and defensive. I love small school athletics, I was just making an observation.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby Bisonguy06 » Sat Feb 18, 2012 2:27 pm

Not angry or defensive, simply putting forth an opinion supported by facts. There are large and small schools in any # class system that you design and the numbers will always be in favor of the large schools.

Parshall, Turtle Lake Mercer, Dakota Prairie, Berthold and North Star have played for state championships in the past five years (boys). Small schools can be successful in the current system and that is all that you can ask.
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Re: Lack of Participation in High School Sports

Postby defensewinsgames » Sat Feb 18, 2012 4:01 pm

Wyndmere-Lidgerwood and North Sargent should be mentioned among them to then
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