Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby BballFan1307 » Fri Dec 18, 2009 3:16 am

A simple ace cheer or a sideout cheer is NOTHING like taunting. Taunting- To reproach in a mocking, insulting, or contemptuous manner. When a team does an Ace cheer they are in no way mocking the other team or insulting them. They are simply celebrating a success on the court. In basketball, when the bench players start chanting out defense *clap clap* .. is that taunting? In baseball when the fielders are "chattering" after getting an out, is that taunting? No. Do you really expect every athlete to just go quietly about everything and show no emotion in success?
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby classB4ever » Fri Dec 18, 2009 9:52 am

"Around the horn" in baseball could be considered choreographed but is only performed with empty bases and is far from time consuming. It is always completed by the time the next batter is ready. Also, one must realize that it has been part of the game for many decades. These choreographed numbers in volleyball are relatively "new" and have come about when all other sports are steering away from that type of celebration. There are some good points on both sides of this one. You hate to take away the "fun" for the kids, but is it necessary to have 3 or 4 different numbers to celebrate? Will they come up with one for substitutions next?
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Indy5 » Sun Dec 20, 2009 3:10 pm

Why can't we have celebration in sports? If you get an ace in volleyball, you have earned the right to do a celebration. If you strike a batter out in baseball, you have earned the right do something like throwing the ball around the horn. If you score a touchdown in football, you have the right to sit and dance in the endzone because touchdowns aren't easy to come by. I'm all for taunting if you have earned the right to do it. I think sports should go back to the way it was when the U was dominating college football and taunting everyone in sight.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby baseball » Sun Dec 20, 2009 3:27 pm

Indy5 wrote:Why can't we have celebration in sports? If you get an ace in volleyball, you have earned the right to do a celebration. If you strike a batter out in baseball, you have earned the right do something like throwing the ball around the horn. If you score a touchdown in football, you have the right to sit and dance in the endzone because touchdowns aren't easy to come by. I'm all for taunting if you have earned the right to do it. I think sports should go back to the way it was when the U was dominating college football and taunting everyone in sight.


Maybe not to the extent of the U in the early 90s haha but i agree someone. these celebrations are in no way rubbing it into the opponent, but instead a celebration of an accomplishment for your team.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Indy5 » Sun Dec 20, 2009 7:05 pm

baseball wrote:
Indy5 wrote:Why can't we have celebration in sports? If you get an ace in volleyball, you have earned the right to do a celebration. If you strike a batter out in baseball, you have earned the right do something like throwing the ball around the horn. If you score a touchdown in football, you have the right to sit and dance in the endzone because touchdowns aren't easy to come by. I'm all for taunting if you have earned the right to do it. I think sports should go back to the way it was when the U was dominating college football and taunting everyone in sight.


Maybe not to the extent of the U in the early 90s haha but i agree someone. these celebrations are in no way rubbing it into the opponent, but instead a celebration of an accomplishment for your team.

O I think it should be to the extent of the U haha. My favorite celebration of all time was when Miami beat Texas 46-3 in the Cotton Bowl. Late in the game, Miami receiver Lamar Thomas catches a long tochdown pass and runs in the tunnel behind the endzone, then turns around and starts pretending to be firing pistols. :lol:
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby NDplayin » Mon Dec 21, 2009 4:02 pm

Indy5 wrote:I'm all for taunting if you have earned the right to do it. I think sports should go back to the way it was when the U was dominating college football and taunting everyone in sight.


Wow, we say things like this and then we turn around and wonder why our youth don't understand concepts like discipline, worth ethic, and respect they way we wish they did.

Question: Those guys from the U who "dominated college football" in the 90s... what kind of example did they set for our youth off the field? How many of them were good citizens? How many were into drugs? How many got arrested? How many of them graduated??

I assume from the 90s reference to the U that you are an adult Indy5, I don't know what sort of profession you are in, but I hope you stayed far away from education and coaching... I would rather you not have any impact on our future generations.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby baseball » Mon Dec 21, 2009 8:14 pm

NDplayin...you sound the the mom who thinks every team/player should win. instead of celebrating with their team would u rather them go over to the other team and say "good try" every time they score? At some point you have to understand the term of competition and let the kids compete and not have everything sugar coated for them.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Indy5 » Mon Dec 21, 2009 8:32 pm

NDplayin, you have a point with the off field deal. I could have done without the criminal records but considering where those guys came from, its a surprise there weren't more off-field problems. With that said, even though they were the flashiest team in the nation, they were also one of the hardest working. Some of the reason for their taunting was at that time Miami was the only school recruiting in the intercity neighborhoods and those players wanted to change football. Like I said, I have no problem with taunting IF
1)You have EARNED the right to do it
2) Its creative and in good nature
and 3) You know when to do it. Don't taunt when your losing, its just not good timing
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby riders » Tue Dec 22, 2009 12:25 am

there is a huge difference in celebrating, lets say a TD in the endzone with your teammates vs. planting someone on a tackle and standing over them talkin smack. taunting is completely classless. be a real athlete and keep your emotions in check, good or bad
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Bisonguy06 » Tue Dec 22, 2009 12:47 am

I'm sorry, but the concept of earning the right to taunt somebody is the dumbest thing that I have ever heard. There's never a right time or place for a student-athlete to taunt somebody. There's supposed to be an educational component to these games. Teach the kids to be humble, not arrogant.

You wanna look cool on the field or on the court? Make a good play and then act like you've done it before!
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Bisonguy06 » Tue Dec 22, 2009 1:00 am

baseball wrote:NDplayin...you sound the the mom who thinks every team/player should win. instead of celebrating with their team would u rather them go over to the other team and say "good try" every time they score? At some point you have to understand the term of competition and let the kids compete and not have everything sugar coated for them.


And you are probably a Terrell Owens/Chad Ochocinco apologist.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby baseball » Tue Dec 22, 2009 2:32 am

Bisonguy06 wrote:
baseball wrote:NDplayin...you sound the the mom who thinks every team/player should win. instead of celebrating with their team would u rather them go over to the other team and say "good try" every time they score? At some point you have to understand the term of competition and let the kids compete and not have everything sugar coated for them.


And you are probably a Terrell Owens/Chad Ochocinco apologist.


Two headlines for ya...

"Fight costs Giants' O'Hara, Eagles' Cole $15K apiece in fines"

"NFL Fines Chad Ochocinco $30K for Poncho, Sombrero" and "NFL Fines Ochocinco $20K For His 'Bribe'"

Whats wrose, having fun while no one gets hurt or fighting? Apparently fun is worse then fighting, tell me how thats right?? people pay these player's multi-million dollar salaries by buying tickets for entertainment. When you get fined twice as much for celebrating then you do for illegal hits, something is out of wack.
What about the college level? Jake Locker for Washington scored a TD last year by diving in the end zone to put his team up in the last minute. while jumping to his feet he threw the ball over his shoulder....how does that deserve a penlaty?? celebrating isnt taunting so i dont get why players need to be given penalties, fouls, fines, etc for celebrating a significant accomplishment. its sends the message that sports are supposed to be fun. It's just a game people, its supposed to be fun.

You dont earn the right to taunt....but you can earn the right to celebrate. teams who win state should be stripped if they storm the court, dogpile on the pitching mound, whatever it is they do after they win the game. thats just a classless way of rubbing the victory in to your opponents. there should be no celebrating at all. once that final out is made, second ticks off the clock, line up and shake hands...dont even give a high five to a teammate..total lack of sportsmanship!
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Bisonguy06 » Tue Dec 22, 2009 10:07 am

I guess we have a moderator who'll defend Ochocinco and downplay his antics. Great... Keep in mind, this is a guy who ditched the last name given to him by a long line of ancestors in favor of the Spanish version of the number on the back of his professional football jersey. I bet his parents are proud.

A couple notes on your points:

*I agree that it seems backwards to fine Ochocinco more than the two guys who fought. However, Ochocinco is a repeat offender, and that's basically why the NFL hits him harder.

*Jake Locker of Washington did not deserve a penalty. I remember that incident clearly, and you're right. Most of us (except for that referee) understand the difference between genuine celebration with one's team and individual, pre-meditated, "look at me! look at me!" type of celebration.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby classB4ever » Tue Dec 22, 2009 10:20 am

Obviously the problem lies between the definitions of "taunting" and "celebrating".
Using baseball's Ochocinco bits vs. fighting should help to see the difference. Ochocinco has been warned repeatedly in advance that he will be fined if he pulls his stunts. He does it anyway and is fined. A fight breaks out during a game, when emotions are running high. There may be fines but as baseball stated, they were less then Ocho's. Nobody should care one iota if Ochocinco is fined, because apparently he doesn't care or else he wouldn't do it. One is premeditated and the other is not.
This takes us back to the choreographed routines vs. the high five or chest butting. One is planned and one is not.
If a football player breaks away and pumps his fist as he enters the endzone he is celebrating. If this same football player breaks away, turns around at the five yard line and starts beating his chest and eggs on the defenders coming after him as he runs backwards into the endzone, he is taunting.
I think the rules they are putting into place are trying to eliminate one while not taking the celebrating aspect out of it. However, there is a fine line and thus why we are having this debate.
One last thing, putting more stringent rules and teaching more "character" in high school athletics might help alleviate some of the problems when these players go on to the next level and I personally think this is what they are trying to do.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby baseball » Tue Dec 22, 2009 3:17 pm

its not hard to distinguish the difference between the 2...taunting is directed at the opponent, celebrating is not. premeditated or not...celebrating hurts no one. so why the big fuss about it?
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby riders » Tue Dec 22, 2009 3:19 pm

ACT LIKE YOU HAVE BEEN THERE BEFORE. personally, i think if you want to celebrate with your teammates you should be able to, within reason. No taking shots at the other team or celebrations to entertain the fans. i'll be one of the first to admit, i did it alot playing defense, your team gets a tackle, do some yelling, get your team jacked, but to taunt (or fight) another team or player is absolutely classless. be humble in your successes
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Indy5 » Tue Dec 22, 2009 4:41 pm

Ok here's something I should have clearified more in my post. I'm all for taunting in the right situation (and not really excessive taunting but some fun, creative stuff). For example in football, if you are a linebacker that smack a runningback in the whole, you should be able to do something to celebrate that hit. But if a DB nails a defenseless receiver, don't taunt because what was he suppose to do not go for the ball?

On a side note.. How can you not love Ohchocinco? You can't tell me you didn't think his fake bribe of the ref wasn't funny.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby classB4ever » Tue Dec 22, 2009 5:13 pm

Honestly, Ocho is entertaining. He isn't taunting the other team but he is taunting the NFL and/or refs therefore his fines.
I will throw this out there. Let's liken it to dunking the ball in warmups. It is against the rules, but it is not hurting anybody and it is very entertaining. Now, if you happen to get caught it is a different story. You have hurt your team by getting a technical.
A question for you, has Ocho ever been flagged for any of his "skits"? Can't remember.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby baseball » Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:00 pm

I'll throw another example out there....I'm watching the Kansas basketball game right now and ive noticed this over the course of the year. everytime their opponent calls a TO and KU has all the momentum, Sherron Collins does a running/jumping hip bump with one of the Morris twins. thats obviously choreographed celebrating....do you call that unsportsmanlike/taunting/whatever?
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Indy5 » Wed Dec 23, 2009 1:33 am

baseball wrote:I'll throw another example out there....I'm watching the Kansas basketball game right now and ive noticed this over the course of the year. everytime their opponent calls a TO and KU has all the momentum, Sherron Collins does a running/jumping hip bump with one of the Morris twins. thats obviously choreographed celebrating....do you call that unsportsmanlike/taunting/whatever?

Yeah exactly. I'm sure thats something they like doing and they are just pumped while they do it. It doesn't hurt anyone and its just celebrating their run so it should be just fine.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Bisonguy06 » Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:11 am

Again, there's a difference between that stuff and the following:

Hiding a cell phone in the padding of the goal post for a post-TD celebration - Joe Horn
Keeping a marker in his sock for a post-TD celebration - Terrell Owens
Wiping his butt on the goal post in Green Bay for a post-TD celebration - Randy Moss
Sending Twitter messages during games - Chad Ochocinco Johnson
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby gobison#6 » Wed Dec 23, 2009 11:37 am

Indy5 wrote:
baseball wrote:I'll throw another example out there....I'm watching the Kansas basketball game right now and ive noticed this over the course of the year. everytime their opponent calls a TO and KU has all the momentum, Sherron Collins does a running/jumping hip bump with one of the Morris twins. thats obviously choreographed celebrating....do you call that unsportsmanlike/taunting/whatever?

Yeah exactly. I'm sure thats something they like doing and they are just pumped while they do it. It doesn't hurt anyone and its just celebrating their run so it should be just fine.

Things like the hip bump or storming the court/field are just things done as celebration when you are pumped up not taunting. so it is just fine.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby Indy5 » Wed Dec 23, 2009 1:27 pm

Bisonguy06 wrote:Again, there's a difference between that stuff and the following:

Hiding a cell phone in the padding of the goal post for a post-TD celebration - Joe Horn
Keeping a marker in his sock for a post-TD celebration - Terrell Owens
Wiping his butt on the goal post in Green Bay for a post-TD celebration - Randy Moss
Sending Twitter messages during games - Chad Ochocinco Johnson

Ok, Ocho shouldn't be twittering during the game thats not taunting its just stupid. Moss's celebration just isn't that good but T.O. and Joe horn's were funny and entertaining and I see no problem with them.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby baseball » Wed Dec 23, 2009 9:22 pm

gobison#6 wrote:
Indy5 wrote:
baseball wrote:I'll throw another example out there....I'm watching the Kansas basketball game right now and ive noticed this over the course of the year. everytime their opponent calls a TO and KU has all the momentum, Sherron Collins does a running/jumping hip bump with one of the Morris twins. thats obviously choreographed celebrating....do you call that unsportsmanlike/taunting/whatever?

Yeah exactly. I'm sure thats something they like doing and they are just pumped while they do it. It doesn't hurt anyone and its just celebrating their run so it should be just fine.

Things like the hip bump or storming the court/field are just things done as celebration when you are pumped up not taunting. so it is just fine.


exactly my point...its a celebration that doesnt hurt anyone. same with 2 teammates doing a dance together after scoring a touchdown. the thing Mark McGwire used to do after a homerun where he and a teammate would give each other a jab in the stomach.....its choreographed and planned, which is what people are saying in the bad part, but it doesnt hurt anyone... so whats the problem?

Take these types of celebrations out of the games and its just going to continue to snowball. the next generation will probably want to penalize for a high five or a good job for being unsportsmanlike....maybe a little bit of an exageration, but my point is that as the years pass people begin to find more and more things offensive.
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Re: Why is taughting allowed in Volleyball?

Postby gobison#6 » Thu Dec 24, 2009 11:13 pm

baseball wrote:
gobison#6 wrote:
Indy5 wrote:
baseball wrote:I'll throw another example out there....I'm watching the Kansas basketball game right now and ive noticed this over the course of the year. everytime their opponent calls a TO and KU has all the momentum, Sherron Collins does a running/jumping hip bump with one of the Morris twins. thats obviously choreographed celebrating....do you call that unsportsmanlike/taunting/whatever?

Yeah exactly. I'm sure thats something they like doing and they are just pumped while they do it. It doesn't hurt anyone and its just celebrating their run so it should be just fine.

Things like the hip bump or storming the court/field are just things done as celebration when you are pumped up not taunting. so it is just fine.


exactly my point...its a celebration that doesnt hurt anyone. same with 2 teammates doing a dance together after scoring a touchdown. the thing Mark McGwire used to do after a homerun where he and a teammate would give each other a jab in the stomach.....its choreographed and planned, which is what people are saying in the bad part, but it doesnt hurt anyone... so whats the problem?

Take these types of celebrations out of the games and its just going to continue to snowball. the next generation will probably want to penalize for a high five or a good job for being unsportsmanlike....maybe a little bit of an exageration, but my point is that as the years pass people begin to find more and more things offensive.

and one of the things that ticks people off is that all these rules about if its taunting or just celebrating takes a lot of the fun out of games. kids are scared to even have a small little dance to celebrate sometimes cuz they dont want to get t'd up or penalized.its bad.i say let the kids celebrate and have fun but dont let them put other teams down or make them feel terrible.
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