2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

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2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby old#63 » Fri Mar 11, 2011 4:21 pm

Thought on what this means to UND athletics?
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby Indy5 » Fri Mar 11, 2011 6:15 pm

They should keep the name. I'm glad it passed. I read the article in the GF Herald about it. I know one of the Native American women was talking about the legislature supporting such a racist act. I think that's ridiculous. The nickname does not cause any negative opinions about Native Americans. If anything, removing the name does. It's the Standing Rock tribe that doesn't approve of the name. I bet they didn't have a problem with the name until UND went DI and the NCAA made them seek approval. Then they thought they'd take a big stand.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby ndlionsfan » Fri Mar 11, 2011 10:40 pm

I think this is just the legislature stepping in where they don't belong in my opinion. They have no control over something like this and I would rather see our tax dollars spent on more meaningful problems.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby woodchuck10 » Sat Mar 12, 2011 1:58 am

Fighting Irish
Fighting Sioux
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby old#63 » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:21 am

I think the bigger issue here is what will the NCAA do now. I would think that they would continue with their exclusion of UND from hosting home NCAA tournament games, wearing anything the contains the nickname or image while playing in NCAA tournaments, and encouraging NCAA members not to schedule UND in non-conference games. The biggest impact will be to football and some of the other lesser followed sports programs. Shouldn't really matter for hockey, which seems to be the only thing UND is worried about anyway.
That is unless this Big Ten hockey conference becomes reality in a couple years, and UND loses the Minnesota and Wisconsin games.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby winner-within » Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:29 pm

Love it!...Ralph has resumed the usual position in his Casket.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby ndlionsfan » Tue Mar 15, 2011 1:59 pm

old#63 wrote:I think the bigger issue here is what will the NCAA do now. I would think that they would continue with their exclusion of UND from hosting home NCAA tournament games, wearing anything the contains the nickname or image while playing in NCAA tournaments, and encouraging NCAA members not to schedule UND in non-conference games. The biggest impact will be to football and some of the other lesser followed sports programs. Shouldn't really matter for hockey, which seems to be the only thing UND is worried about anyway.
That is unless this Big Ten hockey conference becomes reality in a couple years, and UND loses the Minnesota and Wisconsin games.


If I was the NCAA I wouldnt change my stance, just sit back and watch the ND legislatue and the SBoHE go at it and battle it out and let this drag on for another 5-10 years. The NCAA can't be sued by the state again and this legislation is basically unconstitutional, so nothing to benefit UND will come out of it.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby The Schwab » Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:08 pm

ndlionsfan wrote:
old#63 wrote:I think the bigger issue here is what will the NCAA do now. I would think that they would continue with their exclusion of UND from hosting home NCAA tournament games, wearing anything the contains the nickname or image while playing in NCAA tournaments, and encouraging NCAA members not to schedule UND in non-conference games. The biggest impact will be to football and some of the other lesser followed sports programs. Shouldn't really matter for hockey, which seems to be the only thing UND is worried about anyway.
That is unless this Big Ten hockey conference becomes reality in a couple years, and UND loses the Minnesota and Wisconsin games.


If I was the NCAA I wouldnt change my stance, just sit back and watch the ND legislatue and the SBoHE go at it and battle it out and let this drag on for another 5-10 years. The NCAA can't be sued by the state again and this legislation is basically unconstitutional, so nothing to benefit UND will come out of it.


The NCAA isn't going to change their stance, they could care less about what the ND government thinks about the nickname.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby winner-within » Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:40 pm

The Schwab wrote:
ndlionsfan wrote:
old#63 wrote:I think the bigger issue here is what will the NCAA do now. I would think that they would continue with their exclusion of UND from hosting home NCAA tournament games, wearing anything the contains the nickname or image while playing in NCAA tournaments, and encouraging NCAA members not to schedule UND in non-conference games. The biggest impact will be to football and some of the other lesser followed sports programs. Shouldn't really matter for hockey, which seems to be the only thing UND is worried about anyway.
That is unless this Big Ten hockey conference becomes reality in a couple years, and UND loses the Minnesota and Wisconsin games.


If I was the NCAA I wouldnt change my stance, just sit back and watch the ND legislatue and the SBoHE go at it and battle it out and let this drag on for another 5-10 years. The NCAA can't be sued by the state again and this legislation is basically unconstitutional, so nothing to benefit UND will come out of it.


The NCAA isn't going to change their stance, they could care less about what the ND government thinks about the nickname.



They'll have to, North Dakota Government is the people of ND, Ironically the State has no jurisdiction on the Native American people, They're regulated Federally...Now ND Legislators are going to have a say in the finalizes of this Nickname....and with the Consensus of the Native Americans involved (all of them, not just their leaders) it could just happen it stays...Just Like the Wisconsin Chippewas and Just like the Florida St. Seminoles ....Remember it is the University of NORTH DAKOTA :)
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby The Schwab » Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:42 pm

winner-within wrote:
The Schwab wrote:
ndlionsfan wrote:
old#63 wrote:I think the bigger issue here is what will the NCAA do now. I would think that they would continue with their exclusion of UND from hosting home NCAA tournament games, wearing anything the contains the nickname or image while playing in NCAA tournaments, and encouraging NCAA members not to schedule UND in non-conference games. The biggest impact will be to football and some of the other lesser followed sports programs. Shouldn't really matter for hockey, which seems to be the only thing UND is worried about anyway.
That is unless this Big Ten hockey conference becomes reality in a couple years, and UND loses the Minnesota and Wisconsin games.


If I was the NCAA I wouldnt change my stance, just sit back and watch the ND legislatue and the SBoHE go at it and battle it out and let this drag on for another 5-10 years. The NCAA can't be sued by the state again and this legislation is basically unconstitutional, so nothing to benefit UND will come out of it.


The NCAA isn't going to change their stance, they could care less about what the ND government thinks about the nickname.



They'll have to, North Dakota Government is the people of ND, Ironically the State has no jurisdiction on the Native American people, They're regulated Federally...Now ND Legislators are going to have a say in the finalizes of this Nickname....and with the Consensus of the Native Americans involved (all of them, not just their leaders) it could just happen it stays...Just Like the Wisconsin Chippewas and Just like the Florida St. Seminoles ....Remember it is the University of NORTH DAKOTA :)


No it is NOT like the Florida St. Seminoles, FSU has the support of the seminoles in Florida, ND does not have the support of both sioux reservations in ND, until that happens the NCAA will keep it's ban.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby old#63 » Tue Mar 15, 2011 4:51 pm

The only thing I see that would sway the NCAA to change it's stance, is if Standing Rock were to hold a vote of the tribe and it supported the keeping of the nickname. Otherwise, legally, I don't think that North Dakota has the ability in court to force the NCAA to relax their restrictions.

Tough to recruit good local athletes knowing any playoff game they would ever qualify for would be on the road. Just think what a great recruiting tool that Robert Morris football game was for NDSU football.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby winner-within » Tue Mar 15, 2011 9:49 pm

The Schwab wrote:
winner-within wrote:
The Schwab wrote:
ndlionsfan wrote:
old#63 wrote:I think the bigger issue here is what will the NCAA do now. I would think that they would continue with their exclusion of UND from hosting home NCAA tournament games, wearing anything the contains the nickname or image while playing in NCAA tournaments, and encouraging NCAA members not to schedule UND in non-conference games. The biggest impact will be to football and some of the other lesser followed sports programs. Shouldn't really matter for hockey, which seems to be the only thing UND is worried about anyway.
That is unless this Big Ten hockey conference becomes reality in a couple years, and UND loses the Minnesota and Wisconsin games.


If I was the NCAA I wouldnt change my stance, just sit back and watch the ND legislatue and the SBoHE go at it and battle it out and let this drag on for another 5-10 years. The NCAA can't be sued by the state again and this legislation is basically unconstitutional, so nothing to benefit UND will come out of it.


The NCAA isn't going to change their stance, they could care less about what the ND government thinks about the nickname.



They'll have to, North Dakota Government is the people of ND, Ironically the State has no jurisdiction on the Native American people, They're regulated Federally...Now ND Legislators are going to have a say in the finalizes of this Nickname....and with the Consensus of the Native Americans involved (all of them, not just their leaders) it could just happen it stays...Just Like the Wisconsin Chippewas and Just like the Florida St. Seminoles ....Remember it is the University of NORTH DAKOTA :)


No it is NOT like the Florida St. Seminoles, FSU has the support of the seminoles in Florida, ND does not have the support of both sioux reservations in ND, until that happens the NCAA will keep it's ban.


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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby nodaker » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:13 am

A select few on the Standing Rock tribal council do not want this to go to a vote. They know it will pass.

from what I am hearing anyways.....
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby ndfan » Wed Mar 16, 2011 8:29 am

nodaker wrote:A select few on the Standing Rock tribal council do not want this to go to a vote. They know it will pass.

from what I am hearing anyways.....


Yep thats why they won't let the PEOPLE vote cause they know it would pass, if they knew it wouldn't pass they would have the vote today.

This is just the legislature trying to put its nose where it doesn't belong. Let the SBoHE and UND deal with this matter. jmo
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby winner-within » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:24 am

and now because of all the controversy throughout the past 4-5 years people are ready to turn on the Nickname and say "you know, it is time to just let go" which is the same mentality used when they picked the Name, they looked at it as Just a name, Not a person or people, just a name....The mentality was this....You Indians stay in Indian country, we will take your name and use it the way we want to, just like we did your land.

Once the NCAA come into the picture (comity made up of No Native Americans, that has power over posts season tournaments, and College Sports) it opened blind eyes that maybe it wasnt being used the way other Institutions were using there Nickname (where truthfully it had come along way's and thing were looking up) but the NCAA didn't care. Exhausting all avenues in the road to retiring the name is Good, its will either be officially retired or it will remain, and remain with Pride, from both sides.

On another Note tune into KFGO today and Listen to Joel Heitkamp coming live from the united tribes Basketball Gym with all tribal leaders and Law enforcement, Attorney generals and such, there are way bigger issues on the Table than University nicknames on our Reservations in NORTH DAKOTA!
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby nodaker » Wed Mar 16, 2011 9:58 am

My probem with this whole argument is where does this stop?

NFL
Vikings - A bunch of pagan murderers?
Patriots - white guys who were mean to the british and pushed the natives farther west?
Saints - Imposing chritianity on someone who may not agree with it?
Chiefs - maybe some warrior will be upset that the higher ups get all the glory
Buccaneers - Another bunch of murdering thieves
Raiders - ditto
Texans - A few hispanic groups might have a problem with them
Redskins - nuff said

MLB
Braves - native women are left out
Red Sox/White Sox - but I like black sox
Indians - Its "Native American" now. get with the program
Angels - Again with the christianity
Brewers - I dont drink
Yankees - goes way back to colonial days. get out of the way you non-white people
Athletics - I have love handles and like to lay on the couch at night and watch sports center
Pirates - see buccaneers
Padres - see Saints


And a whole list of college teams that should be scared.
Where does the madness stop....lawyers must love this crap. (oops, didnt mean to offend any attornys in this group) my bad
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby winner-within » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:22 am

nodaker wrote:My probem with this whole argument is where does this stop?

NFL
Vikings - A bunch of pagan murderers?
Patriots - white guys who were mean to the british and pushed the natives farther west?
Saints - Imposing chritianity on someone who may not agree with it?
Chiefs - maybe some warrior will be upset that the higher ups get all the glory
Buccaneers - Another bunch of murdering thieves
Raiders - ditto
Texans - A few hispanic groups might have a problem with them
Redskins - nuff said

MLB
Braves - native women are left out
Red Sox/White Sox - but I like black sox
Indians - Its "Native American" now. get with the program
Angels - Again with the christianity
Brewers - I dont drink
Yankees - goes way back to colonial days. get out of the way you non-white people
Athletics - I have love handles and like to lay on the couch at night and watch sports center
Pirates - see buccaneers
Padres - see Saints


And a whole list of college teams that should be scared.
Where does the madness stop....lawyers must love this crap. (oops, didnt mean to offend any attornys in this group) my bad


Apache Braves....Soiux Warriors....a brave was a fighter.....you slung together a list of nothing, bringing the topic nowhere....Where does it end?? it doesn't as long as the Earth is revolving....The question is...is can we take things seriously and put a valid beginning or end to them??? ....Its called dealing with adversity Positively.....Not just using the mentality of... The Heck with it....who cares!
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby nodaker » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:34 am

winner-within wrote:
Apache Braves....Soiux Warriors....a brave was a fighter.....you slung together a list of nothing, bringing the topic nowhere....Where does it end?? it doesn't as long as the Earth is revolving....The question is...is can we take things seriously and put a valid beginning or end to them??? ....Its called dealing with adversity Positively.....Not just using the mentality of... The Heck with it....who cares!


A brave was a fighter? Thanks for clearing that up. They didnt let us go to school here on Ft Berthold
Nothing and nowhere? That was the whole idea.It was a joke. Which is what the NCAA is making of this.
The valid end would be to put it to a vote.
You may not care, but I do.

Now sing me a song
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby winner-within » Wed Mar 16, 2011 10:51 am

nodaker wrote:
winner-within wrote:
Apache Braves....Soiux Warriors....a brave was a fighter.....you slung together a list of nothing, bringing the topic nowhere....Where does it end?? it doesn't as long as the Earth is revolving....The question is...is can we take things seriously and put a valid beginning or end to them??? ....Its called dealing with adversity Positively.....Not just using the mentality of... The Heck with it....who cares!


A brave was a fighter? Thanks for clearing that up. They didn't let us go to school here on Ft Berthold
Nothing and nowhere? That was the whole idea.It was a joke. Which is what the NCAA is making of this.
The valid end would be to put it to a vote.
You may not care, but I do.

Now sing me a song


I was wondering...I follow your post's and thought maybe you were being facetious :D ..Yes the NCAA should have just left it alone, but they were jealous of the beautiful facility's and the unbelievable donations and support of the Alumni and the ND people, ....anyways thats water under the bridge and Yes...I think it will come to a Vote.....

Someday I'll have a backyard BBQ and invite all the Ndpreps Boys, who wanna come...and I'll quit talking and just sing :D
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby bison football73 » Wed Mar 16, 2011 6:09 pm

nodaker wrote:My probem with this whole argument is where does this stop?

NFL
Vikings - A bunch of pagan murderers?
Patriots - white guys who were mean to the british and pushed the natives farther west?
Saints - Imposing chritianity on someone who may not agree with it?
Chiefs - maybe some warrior will be upset that the higher ups get all the glory
Buccaneers - Another bunch of murdering thieves
Raiders - ditto
Texans - A few hispanic groups might have a problem with them
Redskins - nuff said

MLB
Braves - native women are left out
Red Sox/White Sox - but I like black sox
Indians - Its "Native American" now. get with the program
Angels - Again with the christianity
Brewers - I dont drink
Yankees - goes way back to colonial days. get out of the way you non-white people
Athletics - I have love handles and like to lay on the couch at night and watch sports center
Pirates - see buccaneers
Padres - see Saints


And a whole list of college teams that should be scared.
Where does the madness stop....lawyers must love this crap. (oops, didnt mean to offend any attornys in this group) my bad


i have thought this all along. why can a bunch of professional sports teams have names such as the Redskins(which is waaaaaaay more offensive than the Fighting Sioux) and the Indians and the braves and the Chiefs then why cant UND? im sorry but with the reasons that the ncaa is trying to get rid of the nickname then there should have to be a vote on the Fighting Irish. which is absolutely rediculous
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby baseball18 » Sun Mar 20, 2011 1:43 am

ndlionsfan wrote:I think this is just the legislature stepping in where they don't belong in my opinion. They have no control over something like this and I would rather see our tax dollars spent on more meaningful problems.


amen!
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby baseball18 » Sun Mar 20, 2011 1:47 am

nodaker wrote:My probem with this whole argument is where does this stop?

NFL
Vikings - A bunch of pagan murderers?
Patriots - white guys who were mean to the british and pushed the natives farther west?
Saints - Imposing chritianity on someone who may not agree with it?
Chiefs - maybe some warrior will be upset that the higher ups get all the glory
Buccaneers - Another bunch of murdering thieves
Raiders - ditto
Texans - A few hispanic groups might have a problem with them
Redskins - nuff said

MLB
Braves - native women are left out
Red Sox/White Sox - but I like black sox
Indians - Its "Native American" now. get with the program
Angels - Again with the christianity
Brewers - I dont drink
Yankees - goes way back to colonial days. get out of the way you non-white people
Athletics - I have love handles and like to lay on the couch at night and watch sports center
Pirates - see buccaneers
Padres - see Saints


And a whole list of college teams that should be scared.
Where does the madness stop....lawyers must love this crap. (oops, didnt mean to offend any attornys in this group) my bad


umm... those are private organizations. hey apple, meet orange
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby nodaker » Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:07 pm

baseball18 wrote:umm... those are private organizations. hey apple, meet orange


Sherlock......hey baseball, meet sense of humor
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby winner-within » Sun Mar 20, 2011 5:06 pm

baseball18 wrote:
ndlionsfan wrote:I think this is just the legislature stepping in where they don't belong in my opinion. They have no control over something like this and I would rather see our tax dollars spent on more meaningful problems.


amen!


If a Man donates a Hundred and Fifty Million Dollars, and one of his mandatory requests is to Keep the Fighting Souix Name than I think a few Bucks spent by our Legislatures to uphold his Request should be competent to the task. The NCAA should have just not worried about it in the first Place.
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Re: 2011 legislature mandates "Fighting Sioux" keep name

Postby nodaker » Sun Mar 20, 2011 5:37 pm

winner-within wrote:
If a Man donates a Hundred and Fifty Million Dollars, and one of his mandatory requests is to Keep the Fighting Souix Name than I think a few Bucks spent by our Legislatures to uphold his Request should be competent to the task. The NCAA should have just not worried about it in the first Place.


Can I get another Amen....

It should have never gotten this far.
This whole thing may have been averted if the legislature would have got involved earlier.
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