2011 NBA Playoffs

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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Indy5 » Sat Apr 30, 2011 10:04 pm

winner-within wrote:Saying some one is Freak athlete doesn't excuse him of being the best Basketball player on the Planet....your making it sound like he's way off and way behind somebody....like if they take away his Kryptonite he would falter

I didn't say he isn't a great player. He is. I feel he and Durant are extremely close for the best player. LeBron does more statistically for his team in assists and rebounds, but Durant got 6.8 RPG versus LeBron's 7.5 per game. Not a huge difference. LeBron gets 7 assists a game versus Durant's 2.7, but to be fair, LeBron doesn't have a true point like Westbrook on his team. He actually doesn't have a point guard at all. Durant has scored more in each of the past 2 years. Durant is by far the better shooter, where LeBron is much better at getting to the hoop. Different styles of play.

As for the Kryptonite statement, if he had an average player's strength, he wouldn't be a top 15 player. He gets to the hoop so well because he's so big. He's not a very good shooter. This strength makes him a better defender too.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Sat Apr 30, 2011 11:42 pm

Indy5 wrote:
winner-within wrote:Saying some one is Freak athlete doesn't excuse him of being the best Basketball player on the Planet....your making it sound like he's way off and way behind somebody....like if they take away his Kryptonite he would falter

I didn't say he isn't a great player. He is. I feel he and Durant are extremely close for the best player. LeBron does more statistically for his team in assists and rebounds, but Durant got 6.8 RPG versus LeBron's 7.5 per game. Not a huge difference. LeBron gets 7 assists a game versus Durant's 2.7, but to be fair, LeBron doesn't have a true point like Westbrook on his team. He actually doesn't have a point guard at all. Durant has scored more in each of the past 2 years. Durant is by far the better shooter, where LeBron is much better at getting to the hoop. Different styles of play.

As for the Kryptonite statement, if he had an average player's strength, he wouldn't be a top 15 player. He gets to the hoop so well because he's so big. He's not a very good shooter. This strength makes him a better defender too.


I'm wondering if Durant could have taken the Cavs to where they were in 2009-10 by himself, Imagine The Thunder without Westbrook...Durant would be spent....not winning the Scoring Title...He Cant play 4 positions like LBJ
The Impressive Stat with Kevin is he Scores more Than anybody in the League and actually makes the Playoffs and then makes noise in them.

on the other hand:
I've never seen a shot blocker, re-bounder, passer, ball handler, shooter like LBJ.....The NBA works like this....every team is somebody's Team and the Heat is Wade's....If it were not, if it were up for grabs, Lebron would have immortalized the NBA Stat Board this season, he would have set the tone, made his mark in the sand and took over as the leader, Riley wasn't going to let that happen.
So he will ease into the next series like he did the season and take what he can get without making Wade feel, lets say, second fiddle.
Now imagine being good enough to accomplish all that and still move forward against the Celtics...which I'm not saying they will but LBJ is actually capable of getting this done....I still say at the age he is right now he has to take more initiative in life and Marry the mother of his 2 boys, fire his friend as his manager and get the real thing and pay him, become less selfish and more humble and he could become the best of all time before he is 30.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Indy5 » Sun May 01, 2011 12:36 am

winner-within wrote:I still say at the age he is right now he has to take more initiative in life and Marry the mother of his 2 boys, fire his friend as his manager and get the real thing and pay him, become less selfish and more humble and he could become the best of all time before he is 30.

Yes he could be, but in order for this change to happen, he will have to see the light. He'll have to realize he's full of himself and whines too much. He'll have to realize he needs to be more humble and become a better leader. That won't happen because since he was 3, he's been told he's God's gift to Earth. He thinks he doesn't even really need an agent so it doesn't matter if he has his buddy do it. He doesn't need to marry the mother of his children because she'll always wait for him. This revelation will never happen, so he'll go down as maybe the best physically specimen to ever play the game. He'll eventually get a ring or two in Miami, most likely not three. So he won't even be a top 5 player, much less the best.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Flip » Sun May 01, 2011 12:55 am

Indy5 wrote:
winner-within wrote:Saying some one is Freak athlete doesn't excuse him of being the best Basketball player on the Planet....your making it sound like he's way off and way behind somebody....like if they take away his Kryptonite he would falter

I didn't say he isn't a great player. He is. I feel he and Durant are extremely close for the best player. LeBron does more statistically for his team in assists and rebounds, but Durant got 6.8 RPG versus LeBron's 7.5 per game. Not a huge difference. LeBron gets 7 assists a game versus Durant's 2.7, but to be fair, LeBron doesn't have a true point like Westbrook on his team. He actually doesn't have a point guard at all. Durant has scored more in each of the past 2 years. Durant is by far the better shooter, where LeBron is much better at getting to the hoop. Different styles of play.

You have weak arguement for Durant being the best player in the NBA. He does one thing better: shoot. He's a better mid-range jump shooter and FT shooter, and pretty much a wash outside the arc. Lebron is better at getting to the basket, ball handling, passing and rebounding. Also, you never mentioned defense, Lebron has been 1st team all defense the past two seasons.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Indy5 » Sun May 01, 2011 1:45 pm

Flip wrote:
Indy5 wrote:
winner-within wrote:Saying some one is Freak athlete doesn't excuse him of being the best Basketball player on the Planet....your making it sound like he's way off and way behind somebody....like if they take away his Kryptonite he would falter

I didn't say he isn't a great player. He is. I feel he and Durant are extremely close for the best player. LeBron does more statistically for his team in assists and rebounds, but Durant got 6.8 RPG versus LeBron's 7.5 per game. Not a huge difference. LeBron gets 7 assists a game versus Durant's 2.7, but to be fair, LeBron doesn't have a true point like Westbrook on his team. He actually doesn't have a point guard at all. Durant has scored more in each of the past 2 years. Durant is by far the better shooter, where LeBron is much better at getting to the hoop. Different styles of play.

You have weak arguement for Durant being the best player in the NBA. He does one thing better: shoot. He's a better mid-range jump shooter and FT shooter, and pretty much a wash outside the arc. Lebron is better at getting to the basket, ball handling, passing and rebounding. Also, you never mentioned defense, Lebron has been 1st team all defense the past two seasons.

First, it's not at all a wash from outside the arc. Durant is a MUCH better three point shooter. Regardless, maybe LeBron is better at more things and he probably is the better player. BUT, Durant has had a bigger impact on the league this year and last year it was close.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Flip » Sun May 01, 2011 2:15 pm

Indy5 wrote:First, it's not at all a wash from outside the arc. Durant is a MUCH better three point shooter. Regardless, maybe LeBron is better at more things and he probably is the better player. BUT, Durant has had a bigger impact on the league this year and last year it was close.

Durant is 35% Lebron is 33% from 3.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Indy5 » Sun May 01, 2011 3:10 pm

Flip wrote:
Indy5 wrote:First, it's not at all a wash from outside the arc. Durant is a MUCH better three point shooter. Regardless, maybe LeBron is better at more things and he probably is the better player. BUT, Durant has had a bigger impact on the league this year and last year it was close.

Durant is 35% Lebron is 33% from 3.

Ok, but can you honestly tell me that LeBron is close to as good of a shooter as Durant? Sometimes you can't always look at stats. It's not baseball.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Flip » Sun May 01, 2011 4:17 pm

Indy5 wrote:Ok, but can you honestly tell me that LeBron is close to as good of a shooter as Durant? Sometimes you can't always look at stats. It's not baseball.

3 pointers? yes, they are close
everything else Durant is better, I said that a few posts back
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Run4Fun2009 » Sun May 01, 2011 4:33 pm

Western Conference:
#4 OKC and #8 Memphis series tied 1-1
#3 Dallas leads #2 LA Lakers 1-0

Eastern Conference:
#5 Atlanta leads #1 Chicago 1-0
#2 Miami leads #3 Boston 2-0
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Sun May 01, 2011 8:52 pm

Flip wrote:
Indy5 wrote:First, it's not at all a wash from outside the arc. Durant is a MUCH better three point shooter. Regardless, maybe LeBron is better at more things and he probably is the better player. BUT, Durant has had a bigger impact on the league this year and last year it was close.

Durant is 35% Lebron is 33% from 3.


The thunder shoot the least threes in the league on average something like 13 per game, so his 35% beyond the arc is irrelevant to their game plan.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Flip » Sun May 01, 2011 9:11 pm

winner-within wrote:The thunder shoot the least threes in the league on average something like 13 per game, so his 35% beyond the arc is irrelevant to their game plan.

There is absolutely nothing about this statement that is true. Good try though.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Sun May 01, 2011 11:02 pm

Flip wrote:
winner-within wrote:The thunder shoot the least threes in the league on average something like 13 per game, so his 35% beyond the arc is irrelevant to their game plan.

There is absolutely nothing about this statement that is true. Good try though.


I was pointing out something I heard that has to do with Durants overall game and the team he shoots threes so well for...... I thought I heard this during the Memphis game but I will do some research, wasn't aimed at you Flip it was actually in support of your argument.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Sun May 01, 2011 11:20 pm

Certainly my bad it was Memphis who only takes about 12-13 three per game....OKC is at about 22....35% by Durant was true...you didn't have to be that critical...Ha!
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Sun May 01, 2011 11:31 pm

On another note I thought Wade and Lebron and Company played a heck of a game on a Sunday second round matchup with the Clover leafs.....Good job heat!
I though the ejection on Pierce was appropriate and sent a message that your not going to be able to push your weight around with the Heat...why? because they deserve some respect, They've been Criticized since the decision and reality is they have veterans on the team that dont need to be taking any crap from other veterns from opposing team.....Pierce was going to start his big intimidation plan, down by 10 with a few minutes left in the fourth he is the last guy you want dictating the Game because that will spark the come back they were looking for....Game was over after that.....The head butt was stupid. Heat in 4
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Flip » Mon May 02, 2011 12:08 am

winner-within wrote:Certainly my bad it was Memphis who only takes about 12-13 three per game....OKC is at about 22....35% by Durant was true...you didn't have to be that critical...Ha!

You admitted you were wrong, no wonder it is so dang cold outside.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Mon May 02, 2011 12:52 pm

All I know is the Thunder are in real trouble, with only 22 attempts per game It will take more than 35% 3p% from the team to get it done against Randolph and the Grizz.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Indy5 » Mon May 02, 2011 1:22 pm

winner-within wrote:All I know is the Thunder are in real trouble, with only 22 attempts per game It will take more than 35% 3p% from the team to get it done against Randolph and the Grizz.

Durant shot 45% in the Denver series, so he's been shooting them well. He had a good game 1, but they just need to play better D and Westbrook can't have 7 TOs. They'll be fine. Eventually Ibaka's length and Perk's strength will slow down the Grizzlies big men. Gasol probably won't have 20 and 13 again in the series.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Mon May 02, 2011 1:42 pm

Indy5 wrote:
winner-within wrote:All I know is the Thunder are in real trouble, with only 22 attempts per game It will take more than 35% 3p% from the team to get it done against Randolph and the Grizz.

Durant shot 45% in the Denver series, so he's been shooting them well. He had a good game 1, but they just need to play better D and Westbrook can't have 7 TOs. They'll be fine. Eventually Ibaka's length and Perk's strength will slow down the Grizzlies big men. Gasol probably won't have 20 and 13 again in the series.


I don't think Gasol will let off, the Thunder really hasn't dealt with this type of Size down low much this year, and loosing one at home off the Bat is Critical in the second round....The Grizz in 6.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby gobison#6 » Mon May 02, 2011 6:13 pm

winner-within wrote:On another note I thought Wade and Lebron and Company played a heck of a game on a Sunday second round matchup with the Clover leafs.....Good job heat!
I though the ejection on Pierce was appropriate and sent a message that your not going to be able to push your weight around with the Heat...why? because they deserve some respect, They've been Criticized since the decision and reality is they have veterans on the team that dont need to be taking any crap from other veterns from opposing team.....Pierce was going to start his big intimidation plan, down by 10 with a few minutes left in the fourth he is the last guy you want dictating the Game because that will spark the come back they were looking for....Game was over after that.....The head butt was stupid. Heat in 4

I'm not sure on the second technical. Yes he was mouthing off at Wade. Not a good idea. Not sure if it deserved the technical, but I also only saw the highlight of it. The first one was dumb on Pierce's part. He didn't have to get in the Heat players face (can't remember who it was). I wouldn't call it a head butt though. He didn't fully cock back and smack him like Zidane did in the world cup or whatever it was a few years back. It was more of a moment where he got right up against the guy to belittle him. Stupid. But yes, Pierce needs to keep those emotions in check. The Celtics have to concentrate on the game and not the fact that its the Heat vs. the Celtics. I have Heat in 6 although I would like to see the C's win.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby bballfan7 » Mon May 02, 2011 10:13 pm

gobison#6 wrote:
winner-within wrote:On another note I thought Wade and Lebron and Company played a heck of a game on a Sunday second round matchup with the Clover leafs.....Good job heat!
I though the ejection on Pierce was appropriate and sent a message that your not going to be able to push your weight around with the Heat...why? because they deserve some respect, They've been Criticized since the decision and reality is they have veterans on the team that dont need to be taking any crap from other veterns from opposing team.....Pierce was going to start his big intimidation plan, down by 10 with a few minutes left in the fourth he is the last guy you want dictating the Game because that will spark the come back they were looking for....Game was over after that.....The head butt was stupid. Heat in 4

I'm not sure on the second technical. Yes he was mouthing off at Wade. Not a good idea. Not sure if it deserved the technical, but I also only saw the highlight of it. The first one was dumb on Pierce's part. He didn't have to get in the Heat players face (can't remember who it was). I wouldn't call it a head butt though. He didn't fully cock back and smack him like Zidane did in the world cup or whatever it was a few years back. It was more of a moment where he got right up against the guy to belittle him. Stupid. But yes, Pierce needs to keep those emotions in check. The Celtics have to concentrate on the game and not the fact that its the Heat vs. the Celtics. I have Heat in 6 although I would like to see the C's win.


I think the player was James Jones if I remember right. The second one he shouldnt have started running his mouth but watching the game live it looked to me like peirce was just setting a screen and wade lowered his shoulder going into it. Also that little forearm shiver that they called on jermaine O neal i didnt think should have been a flagrant foul, a foul yes but not a flagrant, this is the playoffs you have to expect a little more physical play to happen, this isn't 5th and 6th grade basketball these guys can take a few bumps.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Wed May 04, 2011 10:19 am

Just thought I'd mention something cool that I'm sure others have done, watching the Heat and the Celtics last night (recorded version off the DVR)....towards the end of the Game Lebron went up and Blocked KG...TNT started showing different angles in slow-mo....as the block was initiating I paused it and then you start tapping the foward button and it segments the the motion forward on each tap, as I kept tapping of course Lebron and KG start moving upward, as they reach the very top of their leap (being the last tap upward, and the next tap they start descent)) Lebrons head is about 7-8 inches from the rim and his finger tips are about 3 inches over the Square behind the rim....Absolutely unreal!!! all this off of 2 steps, jumping off both feet....this play really sent a Message (I think) that "its on" :P
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Indy5 » Wed May 04, 2011 12:59 pm

I'm not going to say the Heat won because of the refs but I found the free throw differential a little incredible. 36-22 in the Heat's favor. I personally, think LeBron gets a call no matter what. One time, he fell out of bounds for no reason and drew a foul call. One time Pierce literally did not make contact with him, and he got an and one. Then, he hammers someone(I think Green) takes him out high on a layup attempt then whines that he got a foul called on him.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby bballfan7 » Wed May 04, 2011 2:06 pm

Indy5 wrote:I'm not going to say the Heat won because of the refs but I found the free throw differential a little incredible. 36-22 in the Heat's favor. I personally, think LeBron gets a call no matter what. One time, he fell out of bounds for no reason and drew a foul call. One time Pierce literally did not make contact with him, and he got an and one. Then, he hammers someone(I think Green) takes him out high on a layup attempt then whines that he got a foul called on him.


I've noticed this same thing for a while. Not the free throw differencial, but the better players get calls in their favor more often than not. I dont know what it is but Kobe, Lebron, Wade, and even Pierce from time to time get calls that don't seem to be there. Soon it will be Durant and Rose joining the group.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby winner-within » Wed May 04, 2011 2:13 pm

bballfan7 wrote:
Indy5 wrote:I'm not going to say the Heat won because of the refs but I found the free throw differential a little incredible. 36-22 in the Heat's favor. I personally, think LeBron gets a call no matter what. One time, he fell out of bounds for no reason and drew a foul call. One time Pierce literally did not make contact with him, and he got an and one. Then, he hammers someone(I think Green) takes him out high on a layup attempt then whines that he got a foul called on him.


I've noticed this same thing for a while. Not the free throw differencial, but the better players get calls in their favor more often than not. I dont know what it is but Kobe, Lebron, Wade, and even Pierce from time to time get calls that don't seem to be there. Soon it will be Durant and Rose joining the group.


Lebron gets fouled on 80% of his attacks to the hoop, gets the call 30% of the time...believe me I've watched the Celts enough to know they will usually come out of every playoff match up with more fouls than their opponent.
All Wade and Lebron & Bosh need is for Bibby, Jones and the rest, to do their role play...and Doc has nowhere to go with his team...not this year.
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Re: 2011 NBA Playoffs

Postby Indy5 » Wed May 04, 2011 5:18 pm

winner-within wrote:
bballfan7 wrote:
Indy5 wrote:I'm not going to say the Heat won because of the refs but I found the free throw differential a little incredible. 36-22 in the Heat's favor. I personally, think LeBron gets a call no matter what. One time, he fell out of bounds for no reason and drew a foul call. One time Pierce literally did not make contact with him, and he got an and one. Then, he hammers someone(I think Green) takes him out high on a layup attempt then whines that he got a foul called on him.


I've noticed this same thing for a while. Not the free throw differencial, but the better players get calls in their favor more often than not. I dont know what it is but Kobe, Lebron, Wade, and even Pierce from time to time get calls that don't seem to be there. Soon it will be Durant and Rose joining the group.


Lebron gets fouled on 80% of his attacks to the hoop, gets the call 30% of the time...believe me I've watched the Celts enough to know they will usually come out of every playoff match up with more fouls than their opponent.
All Wade and Lebron & Bosh need is for Bibby, Jones and the rest, to do their role play...and Doc has nowhere to go with his team...not this year.

Actually, the Celtics are a good defensive team. They are a true defensive team. They can actually play D without fouling. The Heat on the other hand, were just hammering people.

I hate hearing people talk about letting the players play in the playoffs. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. They've just played 82 games. Why would we not call it the exact same as those games?
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