Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby baseball » Wed Jan 14, 2009 5:44 pm

sportsguruguy wrote:as of right now you have to go with kobe.its called championships. lebron is a freak of an athlete but until he wins a championship, he should never be considered better than kobe.


again...Shaq.

Kobe is the better clutch player...yea ill admit that. but LeBron doesnt need to be clutch when they are up 15 in the 4th and half the time he doesnt even see the floor in the 4th quarter. Would Kobe have had them championships without Devan George, Derek Fisher, and most of all Shaquille O'Neal. who is LeBron's Shaq? Zydrunas Illgakus...yea they are almost on the same level.

LeBron came in and turned the laughin stock team of the league into a title contender in 3 years
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby sportsguruguy » Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:16 pm

baseball wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:as of right now you have to go with kobe.its called championships. lebron is a freak of an athlete but until he wins a championship, he should never be considered better than kobe.


again...Shaq.

Kobe is the better clutch player...yea ill admit that. but LeBron doesnt need to be clutch when they are up 15 in the 4th and half the time he doesnt even see the floor in the 4th quarter. Would Kobe have had them championships without Devan George, Derek Fisher, and most of all Shaquille O'Neal. who is LeBron's Shaq? Zydrunas Illgakus...yea they are almost on the same level.

LeBron came in and turned the laughin stock team of the league into a title contender in 3 years


again...championships.

next you are probably going to say that lebron is a better player than jordan in his day because jordan was surrounded by well balanced players.lebron did put cleveland on the map.he is a great player,but he has no champioships.if the cavaliers never win a championship while lebron is playing, he will be forgotten about and never be considered better than kobe.he will be just remembered as helping his team at trying to win the title.when lebron wins a title or two it is legit debate.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby The Schwab » Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:38 pm

sportsguruguy wrote:
baseball wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:as of right now you have to go with kobe.its called championships. lebron is a freak of an athlete but until he wins a championship, he should never be considered better than kobe.


again...Shaq.

Kobe is the better clutch player...yea ill admit that. but LeBron doesnt need to be clutch when they are up 15 in the 4th and half the time he doesnt even see the floor in the 4th quarter. Would Kobe have had them championships without Devan George, Derek Fisher, and most of all Shaquille O'Neal. who is LeBron's Shaq? Zydrunas Illgakus...yea they are almost on the same level.

LeBron came in and turned the laughin stock team of the league into a title contender in 3 years


again...championships.

next you are probably going to say that lebron is a better player than jordan in his day because jordan was surrounded by well balanced players.lebron did put cleveland on the map.he is a great player,but he has no champioships.if the cavaliers never win a championship while lebron is playing, he will be forgotten about and never be considered better than kobe.he will be just remembered as helping his team at trying to win the title.when lebron wins a title or two it is legit debate.


shaq won those titles...kobe was along for the ride....same as in miami....shaq is the difference....a man who is 7 foot plus 300 lbs plus and quick on your feet doesn't come along very often
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby baseball » Wed Jan 14, 2009 8:06 pm

Who was the better college player? Kueth Duany or Kevin Durant? Only one has a championship. Who was a better NBA PG John Stockton or Derek Fisher? Matt Bonner or Dwight Howard? Are you saying Kevin Garnett wouldnt make a "legit" arguement for being the best PF until he won the title last year?
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby numba3511 » Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:24 pm

ESPN experts have said that the championship was the only thing missing from KG's rise to the best PF in the league. I do disagree though, he was the best regardless of whether or not he won the Finals.I'm pretty sure sportsguruguy or whatever just watches espn and listens to whatever they say...were comparing two players.. not two teams... If the Lebron James had the teams Kobe did he would have won too..

But to say the only reason they won was because of Shaq is a little unfair.. Kobe had a lot to do with their success.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby bballfan7 » Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:38 pm

numba3511 wrote:ESPN experts have said that the championship was the only thing missing from KG's rise to the best PF in the league. I do disagree though, he was the best regardless of whether or not he won the Finals.I'm pretty sure sportsguruguy or whatever just watches espn and listens to whatever they say...were comparing two players.. not two teams... If the Lebron James had the teams Kobe did he would have won too..

But to say the only reason they won was because of Shaq is a little unfair.. Kobe had a lot to do with their success.


I dont think that anyone is saying Shaq is the only reason they won the 3 championships they did...yea Kobe had a lot to do with it but are you going to say that Kobe wouldve won those championships without Shaq no way. Without Shaq they probably wouldnt have been any where near the Championship.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby The Schwab » Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:18 am

bballfan7 wrote:
numba3511 wrote:ESPN experts have said that the championship was the only thing missing from KG's rise to the best PF in the league. I do disagree though, he was the best regardless of whether or not he won the Finals.I'm pretty sure sportsguruguy or whatever just watches espn and listens to whatever they say...were comparing two players.. not two teams... If the Lebron James had the teams Kobe did he would have won too..

But to say the only reason they won was because of Shaq is a little unfair.. Kobe had a lot to do with their success.


I dont think that anyone is saying Shaq is the only reason they won the 3 championships they did...yea Kobe had a lot to do with it but are you going to say that Kobe wouldve won those championships without Shaq no way. Without Shaq they probably wouldnt have been any where near the Championship.


I am saying that shaq is the reason they won those championships, it's alot easier to play perimeter in the nba when teams have to double and triple down to stop shaq. If you give Lebron shaq in his prime like kobe had him, cleveland probably wins 70 games a year
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby sportsguruguy » Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:48 pm

career high stats........... Kobe .................... LeBron
points............. 81 vs. toronto 1-22-06........ 56 vs. toronto 3-20-05
f goals made ..... 28 vs. toronto 1-22-06 ....... 19 3 times
f goals att......... 47 vs. boston 11-07-02....... 36 vs. toronto 3-20-05
3 pt. made........ 12 vs. seattle 1-7-03......... 7 2 times
3 pt. att.......... 18 vs. seattle 1-7-03 .......... 13 3 times
f throws made ...... 23 2 times ..................... 24 @ miami 3-12-06
f throws att. ......... 27 2 times ................... 28 @ miami 3-12-06
o reb................. 8 @ dallas 4-18-00 ........... 5 3 times
d reb. .............. 13 vs. seattle ................ 17 vs. new york
total reb............. 15 2 times ............. ...... 19 vs. charlette 1-11-08
assists ...........15 vs. washington 2-12-02 .......15 vs. memphis 1-26-05
steals ............7 vs. utah 2-13-06.............. 7 vs. memphis 11-29-07
blocks ............. 5 3 times ....................... 5 2 times
min. played........ 54 3 times .................... 55 vs memphis 11-29-07
all star appearances...10 .......................... 4
NBA championships....3 ........................... 0

here are the stats for career accomplishments. as you can see kobe is on top for the majority of them. at this point in both players careers kobe is a better player. the stats dont lie.give lebron as many years as kobe in the league and it could be a different debate.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby The Schwab » Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:58 pm

sportsguruguy wrote:career high stats........... Kobe .................... LeBron
points............. 81 vs. toronto 1-22-06........ 56 vs. toronto 3-20-05
f goals made ..... 28 vs. toronto 1-22-06 ....... 19 3 times
f goals att......... 47 vs. boston 11-07-02....... 36 vs. toronto 3-20-05
3 pt. made........ 12 vs. seattle 1-7-03......... 7 2 times
3 pt. att.......... 18 vs. seattle 1-7-03 .......... 13 3 times
f throws made ...... 23 2 times ..................... 24 @ miami 3-12-06
f throws att. ......... 27 2 times ................... 28 @ miami 3-12-06
o reb................. 8 @ dallas 4-18-00 ........... 5 3 times
d reb. .............. 13 vs. seattle ................ 17 vs. new york
total reb............. 15 2 times ............. ...... 19 vs. charlette 1-11-08
assists ...........15 vs. washington 2-12-02 .......15 vs. memphis 1-26-05
steals ............7 vs. utah 2-13-06.............. 7 vs. memphis 11-29-07
blocks ............. 5 3 times ....................... 5 2 times
min. played........ 54 3 times .................... 55 vs memphis 11-29-07
all star appearances...10 .......................... 4
NBA championships....3 ........................... 0

here are the stats for career accomplishments. as you can see kobe is on top for the majority of them. at this point in both players careers kobe is a better player. the stats dont lie.give lebron as many years as kobe in the league and it could be a different debate.

Kobe is on top in the categories involving shooting....because he jacks
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby BballFan1307 » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:08 pm

They play completely different styles of play so its really hard to determine who is "better". Kobe has a better shot, Lebron hasn't even got a consistent 20 foot jumper yet. Where as Lebron uses pure strength and athleticism to score on his drives. I'd say Kobe is a better defender. Who would you rather have the ball with 15 seconds left and your down by 2? Shaq on the team or no Shaq i'd still take Kobe and so would these guys...

Fifteen seconds left, down by 2. Who do you want with the ball?

Henry Abbott, TrueHoop: I'll take Kobe Bryant, because of the experience factor. He might jack something wild with a defender's hand in his face, but I know there is absolutely no chance whatsoever that he will get rattled, panic, lose track of the clock, let an ounce of doubt enter his assassin's psyche, nor give the ball to Donyell Marshall.

J.A. Adande, ESPN.com: For a "must-score" possession I'd take Kobe Bryant over LeBron James or any current or historical NBA great. Yes, even the Managing Member of Basketball Operations for the Charlotte Bobcats. If the play breaks down, Bryant has the resourcefulness and athletic ability to create his own shot. And he's the best tough-shot shooter in the game. Ever. Case(s) in point.

Chris Broussard, ESPN Mag: Kobe. He's proved time and time again on the biggest of stages that he can come through in the clutch. This is no knock on LeBron, but right now, Kobe's the clear answer. Obviously, Kobe can score under pressure, but he's also got all the tools to make a great pass or create for a teammate as well.

Ric Bucher, ESPN Mag: Kobe, because, as Stephen Jackson recently noted, he has no tendencies. He can score in every way imaginable. LeBron doesn't even have a consistent midrange game yet and his 3-point range remains streaky. Getting him to give up the ball isn't even all that hard because he'd rather make the pass than the shot.

John Hollinger, ESPN.com: I'd want Kobe in this situation, for a couple reasons. First, he's a little better as a pure scorer. Second, he's a better foul shooter, which in this situation is pretty important since I'd need him to make both just to tie. Third, I have a better shot at getting a 3 with him and winning the game outright.




Chris Sheridan, ESPN.com: On the road, I go with Kobe because he's the guy who is going to be best able to free himself for a 3-point shot, and since we're on the road, we're going for the win. If I'm at home and I'm playing for the tie, I want LeBron, because he is going to be able to either get to the bucket, get to the line or draw so many defenders that it'll leave a shooter open at the 3-point line.

Marc Stein, ESPN.com: Remember Game 4 of the Phoenix series in 2006? From the second Kobe chased down that ball in the backcourt, you knew he was going to win the game at the buzzer. If you were there or just watching on TV, you knew what was coming and you knew the shot was going in. No other player inspires such a feeling of inevitability in the clutch.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby John Cena » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:35 pm

The Schwab wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:career high stats........... Kobe .................... LeBron
points............. 81 vs. toronto 1-22-06........ 56 vs. toronto 3-20-05
f goals made ..... 28 vs. toronto 1-22-06 ....... 19 3 times
f goals att......... 47 vs. boston 11-07-02....... 36 vs. toronto 3-20-05
3 pt. made........ 12 vs. seattle 1-7-03......... 7 2 times
3 pt. att.......... 18 vs. seattle 1-7-03 .......... 13 3 times
f throws made ...... 23 2 times ..................... 24 @ miami 3-12-06
f throws att. ......... 27 2 times ................... 28 @ miami 3-12-06
o reb................. 8 @ dallas 4-18-00 ........... 5 3 times
d reb. .............. 13 vs. seattle ................ 17 vs. new york
total reb............. 15 2 times ............. ...... 19 vs. charlette 1-11-08
assists ...........15 vs. washington 2-12-02 .......15 vs. memphis 1-26-05
steals ............7 vs. utah 2-13-06.............. 7 vs. memphis 11-29-07
blocks ............. 5 3 times ....................... 5 2 times
min. played........ 54 3 times .................... 55 vs memphis 11-29-07
all star appearances...10 .......................... 4
NBA championships....3 ........................... 0

here are the stats for career accomplishments. as you can see kobe is on top for the majority of them. at this point in both players careers kobe is a better player. the stats dont lie.give lebron as many years as kobe in the league and it could be a different debate.

Kobe is on top in the categories involving shooting....because he jacks

What is your source for those stats?
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby sportsguruguy » Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:11 pm

John Cena wrote:
The Schwab wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:career high stats........... Kobe .................... LeBron
points............. 81 vs. toronto 1-22-06........ 56 vs. toronto 3-20-05
f goals made ..... 28 vs. toronto 1-22-06 ....... 19 3 times
f goals att......... 47 vs. boston 11-07-02....... 36 vs. toronto 3-20-05
3 pt. made........ 12 vs. seattle 1-7-03......... 7 2 times
3 pt. att.......... 18 vs. seattle 1-7-03 .......... 13 3 times
f throws made ...... 23 2 times ..................... 24 @ miami 3-12-06
f throws att. ......... 27 2 times ................... 28 @ miami 3-12-06
o reb................. 8 @ dallas 4-18-00 ........... 5 3 times
d reb. .............. 13 vs. seattle ................ 17 vs. new york
total reb............. 15 2 times ............. ...... 19 vs. charlette 1-11-08
assists ...........15 vs. washington 2-12-02 .......15 vs. memphis 1-26-05
steals ............7 vs. utah 2-13-06.............. 7 vs. memphis 11-29-07
blocks ............. 5 3 times ....................... 5 2 times
min. played........ 54 3 times .................... 55 vs memphis 11-29-07
all star appearances...10 .......................... 4
NBA championships....3 ........................... 0

here are the stats for career accomplishments. as you can see kobe is on top for the majority of them. at this point in both players careers kobe is a better player. the stats dont lie.give lebron as many years as kobe in the league and it could be a different debate.

Kobe is on top in the categories involving shooting....because he jacks

What is your source for those stats?


Nba.com
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby TheYessMan » Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:08 pm

The Schwab wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:
baseball wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:as of right now you have to go with kobe.its called championships. lebron is a freak of an athlete but until he wins a championship, he should never be considered better than kobe.


again...Shaq.

Kobe is the better clutch player...yea ill admit that. but LeBron doesnt need to be clutch when they are up 15 in the 4th and half the time he doesnt even see the floor in the 4th quarter. Would Kobe have had them championships without Devan George, Derek Fisher, and most of all Shaquille O'Neal. who is LeBron's Shaq? Zydrunas Illgakus...yea they are almost on the same level.

LeBron came in and turned the laughin stock team of the league into a title contender in 3 years


again...championships.

next you are probably going to say that lebron is a better player than jordan in his day because jordan was surrounded by well balanced players.lebron did put cleveland on the map.he is a great player,but he has no champioships.if the cavaliers never win a championship while lebron is playing, he will be forgotten about and never be considered better than kobe.he will be just remembered as helping his team at trying to win the title.when lebron wins a title or two it is legit debate.


shaq won those titles...kobe was along for the ride....same as in miami....shaq is the difference....a man who is 7 foot plus 300 lbs plus and quick on your feet doesn't come along very often

shaq was never and will never be "Quick on his feet" he is a big guy, but he is not the only reason why the lakers won those championships. both kobe and shaq deserve equal amounts of credit for the accomplishments
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby The Schwab » Thu Jan 15, 2009 6:21 pm

TheYessMan wrote:
The Schwab wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:
baseball wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:as of right now you have to go with kobe.its called championships. lebron is a freak of an athlete but until he wins a championship, he should never be considered better than kobe.


again...Shaq.

Kobe is the better clutch player...yea ill admit that. but LeBron doesnt need to be clutch when they are up 15 in the 4th and half the time he doesnt even see the floor in the 4th quarter. Would Kobe have had them championships without Devan George, Derek Fisher, and most of all Shaquille O'Neal. who is LeBron's Shaq? Zydrunas Illgakus...yea they are almost on the same level.

LeBron came in and turned the laughin stock team of the league into a title contender in 3 years


again...championships.

next you are probably going to say that lebron is a better player than jordan in his day because jordan was surrounded by well balanced players.lebron did put cleveland on the map.he is a great player,but he has no champioships.if the cavaliers never win a championship while lebron is playing, he will be forgotten about and never be considered better than kobe.he will be just remembered as helping his team at trying to win the title.when lebron wins a title or two it is legit debate.


shaq won those titles...kobe was along for the ride....same as in miami....shaq is the difference....a man who is 7 foot plus 300 lbs plus and quick on your feet doesn't come along very often

shaq was never and will never be "Quick on his feet" he is a big guy, but he is not the only reason why the lakers won those championships. both kobe and shaq deserve equal amounts of credit for the accomplishments


Go Watch tape on when he played with orlando and his MVP years in LA....
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby BballFan1307 » Thu Jan 15, 2009 11:16 pm

Lebron had the stats tonight against the Bulls, but couldn't lead his team to the victory. Tied at 87 shot a 3 pointer as time expired instead of driving, there was plenty of time to get a better shot. Also had 8 turnovers. Rose is gonna be special.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby TheYessMan » Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:17 pm

The Schwab wrote:
TheYessMan wrote:
The Schwab wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:
baseball wrote:
sportsguruguy wrote:as of right now you have to go with kobe.its called championships. lebron is a freak of an athlete but until he wins a championship, he should never be considered better than kobe.


again...Shaq.

Kobe is the better clutch player...yea ill admit that. but LeBron doesnt need to be clutch when they are up 15 in the 4th and half the time he doesnt even see the floor in the 4th quarter. Would Kobe have had them championships without Devan George, Derek Fisher, and most of all Shaquille O'Neal. who is LeBron's Shaq? Zydrunas Illgakus...yea they are almost on the same level.

LeBron came in and turned the laughin stock team of the league into a title contender in 3 years


again...championships.

next you are probably going to say that lebron is a better player than jordan in his day because jordan was surrounded by well balanced players.lebron did put cleveland on the map.he is a great player,but he has no champioships.if the cavaliers never win a championship while lebron is playing, he will be forgotten about and never be considered better than kobe.he will be just remembered as helping his team at trying to win the title.when lebron wins a title or two it is legit debate.


shaq won those titles...kobe was along for the ride....same as in miami....shaq is the difference....a man who is 7 foot plus 300 lbs plus and quick on your feet doesn't come along very often

shaq was never and will never be "Quick on his feet" he is a big guy, but he is not the only reason why the lakers won those championships. both kobe and shaq deserve equal amounts of credit for the accomplishments


Go Watch tape on when he played with orlando and his MVP years in LA....

Shaq was skinnier in orlando, but when he was with the lakers he ws not that fast...................
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby baseball » Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:56 pm

hes pretty quick for a man his size....
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby TheYessMan » Fri Jan 16, 2009 4:01 pm

baseball wrote:hes pretty quick for a man his size....

he's the only man his size...
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby baseball » Fri Jan 16, 2009 4:05 pm

TheYessMan wrote:
baseball wrote:hes pretty quick for a man his size....

he's the only man his size...


which adds to the arguement that he was the main reason Kobe has title rings right now.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby BballFan1307 » Fri Jan 16, 2009 4:46 pm

The cavaliers would have more wins with Kobe than they do Lebron
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby The Schwab » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:10 pm

BballFan1307 wrote:The cavaliers would have more wins with Kobe than they do Lebron


Are you Kidding me right now. The Lakers would destroy everyone if they had Lebron. He would have weapons around him for the first time in his career
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby TheYessMan » Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:19 pm

The Schwab wrote:
BballFan1307 wrote:The cavaliers would have more wins with Kobe than they do Lebron


Are you Kidding me right now. The Lakers would destroy everyone if they had Lebron. He would have weapons around him for the first time in his career

put lebron in kobe's situatuion last year. yes the lakers had talent, but no one on the lakers were actually that good until kobe helped teach them how to win.... lebron has his entire career to figure out how to win the games that need to be won.. like the finals
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby The Schwab » Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:13 pm

TheYessMan wrote:
The Schwab wrote:
BballFan1307 wrote:The cavaliers would have more wins with Kobe than they do Lebron


Are you Kidding me right now. The Lakers would destroy everyone if they had Lebron. He would have weapons around him for the first time in his career

put lebron in kobe's situatuion last year. yes the lakers had talent, but no one on the lakers were actually that good until kobe helped teach them how to win.... lebron has his entire career to figure out how to win the games that need to be won.. like the finals


Ok...now i'm convinced your just not very smart. Seriously...do you watch NBA? Kobe know's how to win and Lebron doesn't? How many former all stars were on the Cavs roster when lebron got there? 1 time? Big Z? yea he's a dominant force. When Kobe came into the league, he had the ideal situation. HE HAD SHAQ! When has Kobe won an NBA final without "All that is man" Shaq? During those NBA championship years Shaq put the lakers....heck the whole town of LA on his shoulders and carried them through the post season, kobe was along for the ride. Yea he hit shots in those series, I know this, I'm not an idiot, BUT it's pretty easy to hit shots when guys defending you know that if you give it inside THEY have to go dig it out. Lebron has put the Cav's (a historically bad franchise) and Carried them into the top teir of the eastern conference. If you put Lebron on a Lineup with Pau and Odom, forget about it, Lebron could play the one, two or three. It wouldn't matter. Lebron brings SO much more to the table then Kobe.
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby TheYessMan » Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:47 pm

The Schwab wrote:
TheYessMan wrote:
The Schwab wrote:
BballFan1307 wrote:The cavaliers would have more wins with Kobe than they do Lebron


Are you Kidding me right now. The Lakers would destroy everyone if they had Lebron. He would have weapons around him for the first time in his career

put lebron in kobe's situatuion last year. yes the lakers had talent, but no one on the lakers were actually that good until kobe helped teach them how to win.... lebron has his entire career to figure out how to win the games that need to be won.. like the finals


Ok...now i'm convinced your just not very smart. Seriously...do you watch NBA? Kobe know's how to win and Lebron doesn't? How many former all stars were on the Cavs roster when lebron got there? 1 time? Big Z? yea he's a dominant force. When Kobe came into the league, he had the ideal situation. HE HAD SHAQ! When has Kobe won an NBA final without "All that is man" Shaq? During those NBA championship years Shaq put the lakers....heck the whole town of LA on his shoulders and carried them through the post season, kobe was along for the ride. Yea he hit shots in those series, I know this, I'm not an idiot, BUT it's pretty easy to hit shots when guys defending you know that if you give it inside THEY have to go dig it out. Lebron has put the Cav's (a historically bad franchise) and Carried them into the top teir of the eastern conference. If you put Lebron on a Lineup with Pau and Odom, forget about it, Lebron could play the one, two or three. It wouldn't matter. Lebron brings SO much more to the table then Kobe.

like what?
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Re: Kobe Bryant or Lebron James?

Postby BballFan1307 » Tue Jan 20, 2009 1:12 pm

Baskeball skill = Kobe

Athletecism= Lebron
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