Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

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Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby cornerback*22* » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:31 pm

i put him at least in the top ten
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:31 pm

No.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:45 pm

Jordan
Chamberlain
Alcindor
Robertson
O'Neal
Bird
Johnson
Pippen
West
Maravich
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:51 pm

balla45 wrote:No.


WHAT?

seriously. I am not a huge Kobe fan, but some people have him in the top two of all-time.
Not in the top ten?
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:51 pm

I wrote out my top 10. Who is he better than?
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:51 pm

Rephrase. I wrote out ten players who I think are better.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:54 pm

For one, Scottie Pippen. I don't think he would have gone for near as many titles without the help of the other guy.

Also, and it's hard for me to say this because he's one of my favorite players of all-time. Pistol Pete

Put him in today's game and he world not have near the success.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 8:56 pm

thejoker wrote:For one, Scottie Pippen. I don't think he would have gone for near as many titles without the help of the other guy.

Also, and it's hard for me to say this because he's one of my favorite players of all-time. Pistol Pete

Put him in today's game and he world not have near the success.


He isn't in today's game though, so that doesn't matter. If you put Kwame Brown into the 50's he would have averaged 30 a game. So you can't use that.

How many titles would Kobe have without Shaq? Same thing.:D
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:04 pm

balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:For one, Scottie Pippen. I don't think he would have gone for near as many titles without the help of the other guy.

Also, and it's hard for me to say this because he's one of my favorite players of all-time. Pistol Pete

Put him in today's game and he world not have near the success.


He isn't in today's game though, so that doesn't matter. If you put Kwame Brown into the 50's he would have averaged 30 a game. So you can't use that.

How many titles would Kobe have without Shaq? Same thing.:D


Hold on.

You said best ever in the NBA. You never said best at his time. Compare the skills and you can see how much better players are today. And Kobe dang near had it this year. What happened when Jordan left.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:06 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:For one, Scottie Pippen. I don't think he would have gone for near as many titles without the help of the other guy.

Also, and it's hard for me to say this because he's one of my favorite players of all-time. Pistol Pete

Put him in today's game and he world not have near the success.


He isn't in today's game though, so that doesn't matter. If you put Kwame Brown into the 50's he would have averaged 30 a game. So you can't use that.

How many titles would Kobe have without Shaq? Same thing.:D


Hold on.

You said best ever in the NBA. You never said best at his time. Compare the skills and you can see how much better players are today. And Kobe dang near had it this year. What happened when Jordan left.


You must compare a player against the people he played against. If you don't do that, Wilt is not one of the best players to play basketball.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:09 pm

balla45 wrote:You must compare a player against the people he played against.


If I played against a bunch of third graders and scored 100 points, that doesn't mean I am better than Kobe, who only scored 81 against his opponents
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:12 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:You must compare a player against the people he played against.


If I played against a bunch of third graders and scored 100 points, that doesn't mean I am better than Kobe, who only scored 81 against his opponents


My god. You took that completely out of context. When Wilt played basketball, he was playing against the best players in the world. Just as Kobe is. Thus, the same level of competition.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:15 pm

balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:You must compare a player against the people he played against.


If I played against a bunch of third graders and scored 100 points, that doesn't mean I am better than Kobe, who only scored 81 against his opponents


My god. You took that completely out of context. When Wilt played basketball, he was playing against the best players in the world. Just as Kobe is. Thus, the same level of competition.


No. The best players in the world in the 50's were not as good as the best players now. Period. You have to be better now to dominate the league than ever before.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:18 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:You must compare a player against the people he played against.


If I played against a bunch of third graders and scored 100 points, that doesn't mean I am better than Kobe, who only scored 81 against his opponents


My god. You took that completely out of context. When Wilt played basketball, he was playing against the best players in the world. Just as Kobe is. Thus, the same level of competition.


No. The best players in the world in the 50's were not as good as the best players now. Period. You have to be better now to dominate the league than ever before.


I know this. That isn't the point. The best players in the world are the highest competition in the world. Wilt did what he did against the best competition in the world. Unless you are one of the people who wants to say that every player I named is not one of the ten best all time, because under your logic, Wilt isn't a top 100 player.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:21 pm

balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:You must compare a player against the people he played against.


If I played against a bunch of third graders and scored 100 points, that doesn't mean I am better than Kobe, who only scored 81 against his opponents


My god. You took that completely out of context. When Wilt played basketball, he was playing against the best players in the world. Just as Kobe is. Thus, the same level of competition.


No. The best players in the world in the 50's were not as good as the best players now. Period. You have to be better now to dominate the league than ever before.


I know this. That isn't the point. The best players in the world are the highest competition in the world. Wilt did what he did against the best competition in the world. Unless you are one of the people who wants to say that every player I named is not one of the ten best all time, because under your logic, Wilt isn't a top 100 player.


Wilt is no doubt one of the top players of all time. But my point is still that he would not have been as dominant now as he was.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:23 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:You must compare a player against the people he played against.


If I played against a bunch of third graders and scored 100 points, that doesn't mean I am better than Kobe, who only scored 81 against his opponents


My god. You took that completely out of context. When Wilt played basketball, he was playing against the best players in the world. Just as Kobe is. Thus, the same level of competition.


No. The best players in the world in the 50's were not as good as the best players now. Period. You have to be better now to dominate the league than ever before.


I know this. That isn't the point. The best players in the world are the highest competition in the world. Wilt did what he did against the best competition in the world. Unless you are one of the people who wants to say that every player I named is not one of the ten best all time, because under your logic, Wilt isn't a top 100 player.


Wilt is no doubt one of the top players of all time. But my point is still that he would not have been as dominant now as he was.


Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:31 pm

balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:33 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.


Just because you said it doesn't mean it follows your system of logic. Kwame is better in every aspect of the game that Wilt was. Thus, Wilt is not as good, and Kwame is not top 100 right now, thus Wilt isn't either.

You can't compare a player against a different era. There are so many things wrong with that. I don't know how you don't see this.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:36 pm

balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.


Just because you said it doesn't mean it follows your system of logic. Kwame is better in every aspect of the game that Wilt was. Thus, Wilt is not as good, and Kwame is not top 100 right now, thus Wilt isn't either.

You can't compare a player against a different era. There are so many things wrong with that. I don't know how you don't see this.


You just double-crossed yourself. "You cant compare a player against a different era." So who are you to say that Wilt is so much better that Kwame.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:38 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.


Just because you said it doesn't mean it follows your system of logic. Kwame is better in every aspect of the game that Wilt was. Thus, Wilt is not as good, and Kwame is not top 100 right now, thus Wilt isn't either.

You can't compare a player against a different era. There are so many things wrong with that. I don't know how you don't see this.


You just double-crossed yourself. "You cant compare a player against a different era." So who are you to say that Wilt is so much better that Kwame.


I didn't double cross myself. I will admit that if Wilt and Kwame played in the same era, Kwame would be better. However, Kwame isn't considered a better player, because he is an average player in his era, while Wilt was the best. Make sense?
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:39 pm

balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.


Just because you said it doesn't mean it follows your system of logic. Kwame is better in every aspect of the game that Wilt was. Thus, Wilt is not as good, and Kwame is not top 100 right now, thus Wilt isn't either.

You can't compare a player against a different era. There are so many things wrong with that. I don't know how you don't see this.


You just double-crossed yourself. "You cant compare a player against a different era." So who are you to say that Wilt is so much better that Kwame.


I didn't double cross myself. I will admit that if Wilt and Kwame played in the same era, Kwame would be better. However, Kwame isn't considered a better player, because he is an average player in his era, while Wilt was the best. Make sense?


I see where you're coming from but...

You just stated that "Kwame would be better."
How can Wilt be better if Kwame is the better player?
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:42 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.


Just because you said it doesn't mean it follows your system of logic. Kwame is better in every aspect of the game that Wilt was. Thus, Wilt is not as good, and Kwame is not top 100 right now, thus Wilt isn't either.

You can't compare a player against a different era. There are so many things wrong with that. I don't know how you don't see this.


You just double-crossed yourself. "You cant compare a player against a different era." So who are you to say that Wilt is so much better that Kwame.


I didn't double cross myself. I will admit that if Wilt and Kwame played in the same era, Kwame would be better. However, Kwame isn't considered a better player, because he is an average player in his era, while Wilt was the best. Make sense?


I see where you're coming from but...

You just stated that "Kwame would be better."
How can Wilt be better if Kwame is the better player?


Wilt was the best player IN HIS ERA.

Kwame is an average player IN HIS ERA.

Kwame WOULD dominate IN WILT'S ERA, but he isn't playing it it.

Understand yet?
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby thejoker » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:46 pm

balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.


Just because you said it doesn't mean it follows your system of logic. Kwame is better in every aspect of the game that Wilt was. Thus, Wilt is not as good, and Kwame is not top 100 right now, thus Wilt isn't either.

You can't compare a player against a different era. There are so many things wrong with that. I don't know how you don't see this.


You just double-crossed yourself. "You cant compare a player against a different era." So who are you to say that Wilt is so much better that Kwame.


I didn't double cross myself. I will admit that if Wilt and Kwame played in the same era, Kwame would be better. However, Kwame isn't considered a better player, because he is an average player in his era, while Wilt was the best. Make sense?


I see where you're coming from but...

You just stated that "Kwame would be better."
How can Wilt be better if Kwame is the better player?


Wilt was the best player IN HIS ERA.

Kwame is an average player IN HIS ERA.

Kwame WOULD dominate IN WILT'S ERA, but he isn't playing it it.

Understand yet?



I know where you're coming from. I believe I just said that also.

But Best Players Ever. Not better than players who he had to play against.

Understand?
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:48 pm

thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:
thejoker wrote:
balla45 wrote:Under your logic, he isn't. Why does it matter how he would do now? He did great when he played. That is the only logical way to compare players. The way you are looking at it, Wilt Chamberlain and Kwame Brown are pretty much equal.


Under my logic he is a great. I just said that.

Why does it matter how he would do now? Because there were not the amazingly athletic point guards, Micheal Redd-esque shooters, and Shaq sized big men when Wilt played. And if people now can beat them, Wilt would have to beat them too to be better than the current dominant big man. And I don't think he was suited to do that.

I do think, however, that Kobe would do just fine in the old days of the league.


Just because you said it doesn't mean it follows your system of logic. Kwame is better in every aspect of the game that Wilt was. Thus, Wilt is not as good, and Kwame is not top 100 right now, thus Wilt isn't either.

You can't compare a player against a different era. There are so many things wrong with that. I don't know how you don't see this.


You just double-crossed yourself. "You cant compare a player against a different era." So who are you to say that Wilt is so much better that Kwame.


I didn't double cross myself. I will admit that if Wilt and Kwame played in the same era, Kwame would be better. However, Kwame isn't considered a better player, because he is an average player in his era, while Wilt was the best. Make sense?


I see where you're coming from but...

You just stated that "Kwame would be better."
How can Wilt be better if Kwame is the better player?


Wilt was the best player IN HIS ERA.

Kwame is an average player IN HIS ERA.

Kwame WOULD dominate IN WILT'S ERA, but he isn't playing it it.

Understand yet?



I know where you're coming from. I believe I just said that also.

But Best Players Ever. Not better than players who he had to play against.

Understand?


You said that, then asked questions that seemed to show that you have no idea where I am coming from.

How does Kobe Bryant rank among the best ever in the NBA? Cornerback 22, interpret what you meant when you phrased this question.
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Re: Kobe Bryant: how does he rank among the best ever in the NBA

Postby balla45 » Mon Sep 15, 2008 9:52 pm

I'm also going to throw this out there. Look at the list of the 50 greatest players of all time. Do you notice that people are judged on how they dominated in their respective era?
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