Giving More A Chance to Play

[Jefferson Clark]

i support kids being cut. if a kid gets cut and doesnt have the drive to work hard from that time till the next sport or the next season to make the team then they dont have the drive to play. that kid will be the kid the coach puts in for "equal time" and ends up costing the team the game because they didnt put in the time like the rest of the players out there

[baseball]

i support kids being cut. if a kid gets cut and doesnt have the drive to work hard from that time till the next sport or the next season to make the team then they dont have the drive to play. that kid will be the kid the coach puts in for "equal time" and ends up costing the team the game because they didnt put in the time like the rest of the players out there

i agree, why should kids who put the work in be rewarded with the same thing the kids who didnt do anything get. if you put the work in, you get rewarded by not being cut. but i also have a hard time saying Class B teams cuz since if you dont make varsity your on the jv so its not like they tell you you cant play. your just not one of the 12 best in the program.

[Wild Wolves]

i am not saying that some kids aren't going to get cut but lets be serious, do you really think the drop of would be that drastic if schools with over 300 kids in a class would have two teams at each level.

[baseball]

just so every kid can play....no. people have posted that high school is to prepare kids for college and the real world. how does having 2 teams help that at all. if your gonna say split a class of 300 into 2 classrooms so the teacher to student ratio is smaller, sure im all for that. but to split a high school to have 2 varisty teams is like going all they way back to t-ball. kids have to take failure sometime in life and learn that you have to work to get the things you want. not that they will be handed to you because you have more people eyeing the same goal.

[Jefferson Clark]

It has already shown in the generation entering high school that all these extra teams just show kids that participating is ok. they dont have the drive to excell anymore because they no they have to put minimal work in and they still get to play. the kids that make the top teams or play varsity early realize the potential is there and realize the work needed to be put in. when kids get cut hopefully that teaches them they need to work instead of just be on the team if they really want to play. im saying this is ok at the highschool level, below this kids need to be on teams and develop skills. face the facts everyone wants to win and every team wants to win the championship every year even if its a long stretch, you cant do that with kids that are satisfied just bein in the game

[baller01]

It has already shown in the generation entering high school that all these extra teams just show kids that participating is ok. they dont have the drive to excell anymore because they no they have to put minimal work in and they still get to play. the kids that make the top teams or play varsity early realize the potential is there and realize the work needed to be put in. when kids get cut hopefully that teaches them they need to work instead of just be on the team if they really want to play. im saying this is ok at the highschool level, below this kids need to be on teams and develop skills. face the facts everyone wants to win and every team wants to win the championship every year even if its a long stretch, you cant do that with kids that are satisfied just bein in the game

I disagree with you. That is the problem with putting everyone on a team. Not everyone plays with that passion and will to win. Everyone that is dedicated to their sport and practices, trains, etc. to get better wants to win. Some people are just satisfied with "being on the team." That "being on the team" attitude keeps a player from becoming the best player he can be. If you put everyone on a team they may become satisfied with just getting to play as compared to having to fight to be on the Varsity because every GOOD varsity team should want to win.

[Wild Wolves]

The real world, what are you talking about? Most kids can't transer writing a paper in English to writing a paper in science class. What I have to use capital letters to start sentences So how are they going to transfer working on the jump shot to working on going a real jump?

I would rather have a kid who has been part of a team and understands the role they are playing then have a 89%free throw shooter who spends his day wodding up paper and chucking it at the garbage can.

Get more kids involved, get them off their behind and get them in the game.
Great five kids out of 250 get the benifits of being on a team. I don't think this is about competition, because not many kids want to look stupid infront of their peers and getting beat badly what fit the bill. More kids would have to work at it. More kids could have a dream of getting on the team. Once on the team then the coach and his/her peers can push for greater time and effort.

Heck I still think it should get out of the school. Let the parents run the show.

[baseball]

my analogy to the real world was that its about work ethic, not if a kid can seperate a list of elements from a list of verbs..... the people that get ahead in the corporate world are the people who spend hours upon hours working in there office after closing time, not the people who duck out once the clock turns to 5 PM. same goes for basketball. the kid who spends time in the gym before and after practice are the ones who are going to play, not the kids who show up 5 minutes before practice and leave once the final whistle is blown.

so my question....whos going to get the raise/promotion, the guy working before and after hours or the guy who barely shows up on time and leave right when they lock the doors? whose going to get the A in english (your example), the kid who spends all night working on the paper or the kid who bulls is way through it 15 minutes before class? why should it be different in basketball?

[Wild Wolves]

The guy who does the best work.

I have friends who work tons of hours padding the OT. I have other friends who work tons of hours to get done what others finsih in an 8 hour day.

The ones who get the raise are the ones who are most effective in what they are doing. Time in the real world is valuable, get the job done well and get it done quickly.
I have two good friends who work together. One is a supervisor the other a general laborer. The supervisor has been covering for the laborer for several years in certain areas. The supervisor dreads when the laborer volunteers for certain assignments because he has been doing it wrong every time and the supervisor ends up fixing it himself. (What some guys do to perserve a friendship). The point is that just because you have done things for years or weeks or practiced doesn't mena that you have been doing it right.

[baseball]

that i do agree with, in the real world you can be great at a job and not spend in hours of overtime. but you cant get better at basketball if you dont. basketball is all about work. the old saying says it.....its out of your control if your more talented, but its in your control if your a harder worker. how many people a year get told they are too small? happens all the time. Warrick Dunn, Nate Robinson, Mugsey? Boges. thats an example of people working harder in the off season to overcome what people always say is their flaw. the perfect example for the hard work theory is Micheal Jordan. cut from his high school varsity team as a sophomore, 2 years later hes leading North Carolina, and 20 years later hes considered the best basketball player in history. would that have happened if he werent cut because his school had 2 varsity teams. probably not....

[HeisAlive]

Why stop @ high school, with some thinking going around, lets give "Little Johnny" a full ride to Duke and have him start for coach K, even tho "Little Johnny" has never seen the inside of a gym and spells gym "J-I-M." The only "ballin" "Little Johnny" has done is on his PSP and he wants to start at his local HS... Yea give him a full ride to Duke.

[baseball]

Why stop @ high school, with some thinking going around, lets give "Little Johnny" a full ride to Duke and have him start for coach K, even tho "Little Johnny" has never seen the inside of a gym and spells gym "J-I-M." The only "ballin" "Little Johnny" has done is on his PSP and he wants to start at his local HS... Yea give him a full ride to Duke.

he deserves it just as much as Demarcus Nelson...

[baller01]

Ok guys, I think we should propose this plan to the NDHSAA and see if we can get it to pass. Tell me Wild Wolves what you think of it...

1.) Each team is made up of 10 players. If a school has 30 boys out for basketball, then that school has 3 teams. If a school has 120 boys out for basketball, the school has 12 teams. Etc.

2.) 5 of the 10 players play the first half of the game while the other 5 players play the second half. This way everyone gets fair and equal playing time. In class A each 5 would play 18 minutes while in class B each 5 players would play 16 minutes. If there is a tie at the end of the game, there will be NO OVERTIME since some players would get more playing time which would be unfair to the other 5.

3.) State tournaments should be expanded to 16 teams for class A and 32 teams for class B. This way a vast number of teams get to participate in a state tournament allowing more kids to play in the tournament. BIG HUGE SHINY trophies will be given out for places 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th, 13th, 14th, 15th, and 16th for the class A division so everyone can say they won a trophy at state and BIG HUGE SHINY trophies will be given to places 1st through 32nd in class B so those players can say they won a trophy at state too.

4.) Each player that participates in basketball over the course of the year will receive individual trophies from the NDHSAA congratulating them on their participation over the year so no player feels unrecognized.

5.) There will be no all-district teams, no all-region teams, no all-tournament teams, no all-state teams, etc, as we would not want a vast majority of the players left off of these teams. It would be unfair to those that didn't make such teams.

Tell me what you guys think? I think it is pretty good. My plan does everything that Wild Wolves wants. It gives everyone a fair and equal oppurtunity to be successful on a team as well as equal playing time and also allows more teams and players to experience state tournaments.

[baseball]

what if a school has 11-19 players out? so they just cancel the season because some kids would play more??

[Wild Wolves]

Ok guys, I think we should propose this plan to the NDHSAA and see if we can get it to pass. Tell me Wild Wolves what you think of it...

1.) Each team is made up of 10 players. If a school has 30 boys out for basketball, then that school has 3 teams. If a school has 120 boys out for basketball, the school has 12 teams. Etc.

2.) 5 of the 10 players play the first half of the game while the other 5 players play the second half. This way everyone gets fair and equal playing time. In class A each 5 would play 18 minutes while in class B each 5 players would play 16 minutes. If there is a tie at the end of the game, there will be NO OVERTIME since some players would get more playing time which would be unfair to the other 5.

3.) State tournaments should be expanded to 16 teams for class A and 32 teams for class B. This way a vast number of teams get to participate in a state tournament allowing more kids to play in the tournament. BIG HUGE SHINY trophies will be given out for places 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th, 13th, 14th, 15th, and 16th for the class A division so everyone can say they won a trophy at state and BIG HUGE SHINY trophies will be given to places 1st through 32nd in class B so those players can say they won a trophy at state too.

4.) Each player that participates in basketball over the course of the year will receive individual trophies from the NDHSAA congratulating them on their participation over the year so no player feels unrecognized.

5.) There will be no all-district teams, no all-region teams, no all-tournament teams, no all-state teams, etc, as we would not want a vast majority of the players left off of these teams. It would be unfair to those that didn't make such teams.

Tell me what you guys think? I think it is pretty good. My plan does everything that Wild Wolves wants. It gives everyone a fair and equal oppurtunity to be successful on a team as well as equal playing time and also allows more teams and players to experience state tournaments.

You just don't get my arguement. It is OK I know lots of other slow people so I will type slower so you can understand.

ND has a declining rural population and most of the class A schools are stable or growing. With that in mind fewer kids are participating in HS athletics statewide. Why not keep the number of participants at bout the same level. School districts in their wisdom have gone to middle schools and sophomore only schools instead of creating smaller HSs. Why not give more kids an opportunity to continue competing? I didn't say every kid should get to play, I didn't say that, or anything like it.

I hope I typed slow enough so that you can comprehend this arguement

[baseball]

what schools are sophomore only? cant say ive ever heard of that in ND

[AC-DC]

More than one varsity team doesn't sound like a good idea. If you still have that many kids that want to play, why not expand your JV squads or have more than one. If it's just about playing, there should be plenty of games to pick up and they shouldn't care about playing for a trophy. You could even host a JV invitational tournament if you like. With all the talk about declining participation, having too many players is a good problem and not that difficult to solve.

[Wild Wolves]

Minot has Central Campus and Magic City. One 11 & 12 and the other 10.

West Fargo has kicked the idea around.
Having to many players is agood problem and not difficult to solve!

Exactly!

If I were a coach I would much rather have to make a tough choice in regards to who to cut than to have to beg kids to play.

[eyeinthesky]

Minot has Central Campus and Magic City. One 11 & 12 and the other 10.

West Fargo has kicked the idea around.
Having to many players is agood problem and not difficult to solve!

Exactly!

If I were a coach I would much rather have to make a tough choice in regards to who to cut than to have to beg kids to play.

Central Campus in Minot consists of 9th and 10th grades. Still not really sure what that has to do with any of this though

[baseball]

Minot has Central Campus and Magic City. One 11 & 12 and the other 10.

West Fargo has kicked the idea around.
Having to many players is agood problem and not difficult to solve!

Exactly!

If I were a coach I would much rather have to make a tough choice in regards to who to cut than to have to beg kids to play.

Central Campus in Minot consists of 9th and 10th grades. Still not really sure what that has to do with any of this though

im not sure if this is what he meant but what i got out of it was that he wants minot to have 2 teams. 1 for Magic City, and one for Central Campus??

[eyeinthesky]

Minot has Central Campus and Magic City. One 11 & 12 and the other 10.

West Fargo has kicked the idea around.
Having to many players is agood problem and not difficult to solve!

Exactly!

If I were a coach I would much rather have to make a tough choice in regards to who to cut than to have to beg kids to play.

Central Campus in Minot consists of 9th and 10th grades. Still not really sure what that has to do with any of this though

im not sure if this is what he meant but what i got out of it was that he wants minot to have 2 teams. 1 for Magic City, and one for Central Campus??

He understands it is the SAME high school right?!? That is like saying NDSU should have 23 teams because it has 23 buildings.

[Deuce]

His argument was that Minot and West Fargo are not wanting to build additional high schools, they just keep splitting into more campuses to be able to accomodate the rising # of students. Minot has 1846 students 9-12 which is like 2 Dickinsons, 3 Wahpetons/DL but they only have 1 team. West Fargo is doing the same. Rather than building another high school they're looking at building another campus to house the lower grades.

[baseball]

His argument was that Minot and West Fargo are not wanting to build additional high schools, they just keep splitting into more campuses to be able to accomodate the rising # of students. Minot has 1846 students 9-12 which is like 2 Dickinsons, 3 Wahpetons/DL but they only have 1 team. West Fargo is doing the same. Rather than building another high school they're looking at building another campus to house the lower grades.

i can see that if he wasnt saying schools should have 2 teams....but that was his whole idea to get more kids a chance to play.

[Deuce]

If they would have built another high school rather than another campus then 12 more kids would have gotten to play so once a school gets that big then why not let them field 2 teams rather than 1. The #s are there to support it but I think it would be a political nightmare.

[baseball]

but kids want to compete too, so how competative would that 9 and 10 grade campus be in class a when they have the 11-12 across down. they only way they should field 2 teams to a town is if there are 2 school, not 2 campus'. and this is schools have jv, sophomore, freshman, c squad whatever. so more kids do get the chance to play. the varsity is reserved for the 12 BEST players in your school. if playing was the only thing you cared about it woldnt matter what level. as long as your playing against other kids in your skill level